I was on a flight pre take off when the captain came into the cabin and hauled a passenger over the coals for having left their phone switched on, Presumably the phone was affecting the aircrafts instrumentation.
My phone has a flight mode but I guess it will never get used, its easier to ensure all phones are switched off than risk some being on in the wrong mode.
Hi vic8700, I hope all is well with you. If you don't have a definitive answer then there's no hope for the rest of us! I think this is very much a grey area and from what I can find, the CAA are just taking the precautionary principle and recommending mobiles are off, including flight safe modes. It seems the majority of airlines are taking the CAA's (and FAA's) advice on this issue and adopting their approach, but others seemingly not. There could be a training issue in that some cabin crew think flight safe mode is ok? I've always been told flight safe isn't allowed but others on here have different experiences. I think the best approach for us on HT would be to advise no flight safe mode unless safety announcements / cabin crew say otherwise.
I hope the introduction of OnAir is later rather than sooner. This is likely to be rolled out by the major schedule airlines, who knows if the charters will follow suit in the future. I couldn't think of a worse place to be for hours on end with mobiles phones constantly going off. Imagine all the 'guess where I'm phoning you from' calls there'll be until the novalty wears off
Darren
I hope the introduction of OnAir is later rather than sooner. This is likely to be rolled out by the major schedule airlines, who knows if the charters will follow suit in the future. I couldn't think of a worse place to be for hours on end with mobiles phones constantly going off. Imagine all the 'guess where I'm phoning you from' calls there'll be until the novalty wears off
Darren
Sunbear,
It can often be heard in their head-sets as a buzzing sound when a mobile phone is switched on. That can lead to missed tramsmissions with ground/ATC which is an obvious concern. I've got a transcript from a pilot who suspected the Airbus he was flying at the time went haywire due to an active mobile phone. I've asked the pilot if I can post it hear but I've not been given persmission as yet.
Darren
I was on a flight pre take off when the captain came into the cabin and hauled a passenger over the coals for having left their phone switched on, Presumably the phone was affecting the aircrafts instrumentation.
It can often be heard in their head-sets as a buzzing sound when a mobile phone is switched on. That can lead to missed tramsmissions with ground/ATC which is an obvious concern. I've got a transcript from a pilot who suspected the Airbus he was flying at the time went haywire due to an active mobile phone. I've asked the pilot if I can post it hear but I've not been given persmission as yet.
Darren
I've now been granted permission to post the following from the pilot who this occurred to. I've removed all reference to the airline and any names to keep things anonymous. It's a word for word account of what the pilot experienced that in his professional opinion, was the result of a mobile phone being switched on in-flight. The only alterations I've made are grammatical corrections and added the meaning of a couple of acronyms. The following happened in 2006 on the 4th leg of the day (ie 4th flight) and the pilot also flew the same aircraft the following day and never had a similar occurrence.
I just wanted to post this to give you a real world example what 'can' happen. Although the use of mobile phones, and other electronic equipment for that matter is often classed as a potential risk, this goes to show what the consequences of ignoring these safety procedures can have.
Darren
The biggest and most broken rule we run into is the mobile (cellular phones) which are left ON during the flight. At this point I have to say that to my knowledge there is no proof of phone interference making an airplane crash (correct me if I am wrong) and I have different views of harms and harmlessness of mobile phones in flight.
But until few days ago I have never experienced anything like this.
After a long 4 leg flight we were coming back to our lay over destination at around 1 o'clock AM. We were cleared to descend 5500 feet and cleared for the approach, our speed was green circle speed which was 210 kts that day. And I was planning to ask for the flaps1. Suddenly although in a shallow descent the Autopilot started to loose the speed, went below the green circle and the AP (auto pilot) disconnected. At that point we continued down past the 5500 feet. I took the controls, maintained the flight path and tried to reengage the AP, but both no 2 and 1 were useless.
So I continued manual flight started to raise the nose to be level back at 5500ft again but this time speed kept dropping. Although the Autothrust seemed active, it wasn't increasing the thrust to compensate the speed loss. This all happened in maximum 3 seconds.
I pushed the thrust levers to TOGA (take off / go around) and at the same time capt jumped to put the flaps 1. The airplane roared with the TOGA thrust kicking in and we gained our speed and altitude back. Then the approach flown manually to the landing without further incident other than the ATC comes in and says "we were very much worried about you guys" makes us feel sad about it.
After the landing the Chief flight attendant came in and said she heard a phone ring a few seconds before the engine noise which scared everybody including themselves.
This is what I experienced a few days ago. All signs makes me believe that the cell phone interference is a strong suspect for this. So what do you think about the effects of cell phones to flight safety?
I just wanted to post this to give you a real world example what 'can' happen. Although the use of mobile phones, and other electronic equipment for that matter is often classed as a potential risk, this goes to show what the consequences of ignoring these safety procedures can have.
Darren
On our recent jaunt to Paris with Easyjet the cabin crew on both outbound and return told us to either switch off our phones or for those with Flight Safe mode switch the phone to Flight Safe Mode.
Three main reasons:
Firstly, it takes your attention away from your suroundings.
Secondly, if the aircraft has a problem during take off or landing and the cabin crew have to shout 'brace, brace, brace' or other instructions in the event of an emergency, you won't be able to hear it.
Thirdly, if the aircraft has a rejected take off and the brakes are applied fully (and believe me, they are way more powerful than your standard car brakes), the mp3 player or anything which is unrestrained for that matter becomes a projectile. The aircraft can be doing 140+ mph at take off so you wouldn't want that flying down the isle and hitting someone in the back of the head.
Question about reason 3, why have flight attendants not said anything to me for reading during take off? OH was sat on front row first time he flew and person next to him was told to put book away as rwading isn't allowed during take off and landing. That was with Easyjet back in 2002. I've had book in my hand when flight attendants have come round checking passengers have seat belts on a couple of times and nothing has been said. Coming back from England with Ryanair back in May, my MP3 player was round my neck (has lanyard earohones) switched off and nothing was said.
cate_taylor,
You'll have to ask the CAA that I'm afraid, I can only tell you the rules! Whether they are implemented on every flight is up to the cabin crew.
Darren
You'll have to ask the CAA that I'm afraid, I can only tell you the rules! Whether they are implemented on every flight is up to the cabin crew.
Darren
Question about reason 3, why have flight attendants not said anything to me for reading during take off? OH was sat on front row first time he flew and person next to him was told to put book away as rwading isn't allowed during take off and landing. That was with Easyjet back in 2002. I've had book in my hand when flight attendants have come round checking passengers have seat belts on a couple of times and nothing has been said.
As crew myself we would ask people on the front row (which is classed as an emergency exit row) to put away all reading matter and music etc. This is so that we can have their full attention as we may need them to help evacute the aircraft or help with an exit should there be an emergency.
We would only allow ABPs (able bodies passengers) to sit in certain seats in this row anyway, and we would expect their full attention at critical parts of the flight. If you had your head in a book or newspaper, you possibly wouldn't be aware of what is going on around you.
OH and I don't sit in emergency exit rows anyway. Back in May, Ryanair did allow people sat in emergency seats over the wing to get hand luggage down from lockers during cruise part of flight. They did have newspapers on their laps when flight crew went along checking seat belts but weren't reading them and nothing was said to them which did surprise me.
cate_taylor,
During the cruise it isn't a problem. It's only during critical parts of flight when the chances, allbeit still small, of a problem are higher, ie during take off and landing. In the event of a rejected take off or forced/emergency landing, walkways and emergency exits need to be free from bags etc which may otherwise slow down an evacuation. If anything happens during the cruise, you generally have time to react or reactions aren't needed in worse case scenario.
Darren
During the cruise it isn't a problem. It's only during critical parts of flight when the chances, allbeit still small, of a problem are higher, ie during take off and landing. In the event of a rejected take off or forced/emergency landing, walkways and emergency exits need to be free from bags etc which may otherwise slow down an evacuation. If anything happens during the cruise, you generally have time to react or reactions aren't needed in worse case scenario.
Darren
I have an Orange SPV M3100, it is important to put the phone into Flight mode, switching the phone off does not deactivate the phone, it will always try to connect to a newtoek even if switched off. Unlike a normal phone the off button on these is more like a standby button on your TV.
Dave
Dave
Found the following on the Ryanair website:-
Post edited for copyright reasons. To access the page Pippa refers to, please click here.
David HT Mod
Post edited for copyright reasons. To access the page Pippa refers to, please click here.
David HT Mod
The Ryanair Website states re. use of mobile phones on board planes. 'Another reason to fly Ryanair'. For me it would be another reason not to fly Ryanair. All I need is someone sitting near me chatting on the phone throughout the flight.
This was announced by Ryanair somewhile ago, does anyone know whether the use of phones on the flights with Ryanair has been approved or is now in effect?
A poll was conducted by Skytrax a few months ago asking if people wanted the use of phones on board to be approved and there was an overwhelming vote against it.
This was announced by Ryanair somewhile ago, does anyone know whether the use of phones on the flights with Ryanair has been approved or is now in effect?
A poll was conducted by Skytrax a few months ago asking if people wanted the use of phones on board to be approved and there was an overwhelming vote against it.
We get it a lot in air traffic when visitors come in our ops room with mobile phones in their pockets on silent, all through our headsets the RT goes haywire for a second or so.
As part of our job we have to fly a couple of times a year on the flight decks to see the problems that aircrews face (they sit with us as well). Anyway, there I was in the cockpit of an old 747 -200 over Africa when there was a fail warning on a critical part of the aircraft. The crew tried several times to reset and it wouldn't. Cutting a long story short the crew traced the fault to a specific part of the airframe and one was depatched to investigate. When they got there they found a bloke punching in addresses in his new mobile phone. The passenger was most fed up when told to turn it off, when he did problem on the flight deck was solved.
The captain explained to me that at 37,000ft when there is no signal, the mobile is searching on max power disrupting circuits around it. Its not as bad on new airframes. Can you imagine this scenario at half a mile from touchdown on a wet night at Heathrow where the margin for error is miinimal and the pilot has a split second to make a decision on the information he is faced with?
Anyway, on the opposite side of the coin - I can't think of a single emergency over the past 10 years in our air traffic centre that was attributable to a mobile phone!
Doesn't add much to the debate, but I like to add both sides of the argument!
As part of our job we have to fly a couple of times a year on the flight decks to see the problems that aircrews face (they sit with us as well). Anyway, there I was in the cockpit of an old 747 -200 over Africa when there was a fail warning on a critical part of the aircraft. The crew tried several times to reset and it wouldn't. Cutting a long story short the crew traced the fault to a specific part of the airframe and one was depatched to investigate. When they got there they found a bloke punching in addresses in his new mobile phone. The passenger was most fed up when told to turn it off, when he did problem on the flight deck was solved.
The captain explained to me that at 37,000ft when there is no signal, the mobile is searching on max power disrupting circuits around it. Its not as bad on new airframes. Can you imagine this scenario at half a mile from touchdown on a wet night at Heathrow where the margin for error is miinimal and the pilot has a split second to make a decision on the information he is faced with?
Anyway, on the opposite side of the coin - I can't think of a single emergency over the past 10 years in our air traffic centre that was attributable to a mobile phone!
Doesn't add much to the debate, but I like to add both sides of the argument!
Judith,
As far as I know, the system is not in place as yet. There's nothing externally different about FR's aircraft anyway and I'd expect some kind of antenae. I think they were looking at the OnAir system but I've not heard anything for a while or about its approval (there's a link on this thread to it I think). I agree with you, the last place I'd want to sit is on board an aircraft with a phone going off every 10 seconds and 'guess where I am' replies. There's been technology around for years to allow you to make calls from aircraft based on satalite telephony which many of the mainstream scheduled airlines have fitted. Mobile phones are more convenient but also very disruptive. The longer they are banned the better in my eyes.
Anyway, I have a date with 9 red aircraft: I'm off to day 2 of the Blackpool Airshow
I'm hoping the weather is drier than day 1, I'm still drying out!
Darren
As far as I know, the system is not in place as yet. There's nothing externally different about FR's aircraft anyway and I'd expect some kind of antenae. I think they were looking at the OnAir system but I've not heard anything for a while or about its approval (there's a link on this thread to it I think). I agree with you, the last place I'd want to sit is on board an aircraft with a phone going off every 10 seconds and 'guess where I am' replies. There's been technology around for years to allow you to make calls from aircraft based on satalite telephony which many of the mainstream scheduled airlines have fitted. Mobile phones are more convenient but also very disruptive. The longer they are banned the better in my eyes.
Anyway, I have a date with 9 red aircraft: I'm off to day 2 of the Blackpool Airshow
I'm hoping the weather is drier than day 1, I'm still drying out!Darren
Irrespective of the fact I have no desire for making use of my mobile on a plane, I find the idea that we Must Have/Use these or other electronic gadgets on the plane rather silly.
You may have TV fitted in a car but it cannot be mounted where the driver can view it, much as some may wish to do so, for a very good reason.
Safety.
My personal view is that the rules are made for a good reason, it is not that they wish to spoil things. It would make life a lot more simple for the crew if they could allow it.
The restrictions applied because of the terrorist threats elicited a similar response from some people. Why did they have to apply to them.
I wonder why some people feel they are special cases.
You will I'm afraid always have those who think the rules do not apply to them, their rights are being infringed.
The answer is quite simple. You either accept the restrictions that are applied or you do not travel.
If you lose your licence because you drink and drive you lose your licence and the right to drive. The same should apply to those who insist on doing their own thing on aircraft.
Now being banned from flying might just make some of these people rethink their ideas.
fwh
You may have TV fitted in a car but it cannot be mounted where the driver can view it, much as some may wish to do so, for a very good reason.
Safety.
My personal view is that the rules are made for a good reason, it is not that they wish to spoil things. It would make life a lot more simple for the crew if they could allow it.
The restrictions applied because of the terrorist threats elicited a similar response from some people. Why did they have to apply to them.
I wonder why some people feel they are special cases.
You will I'm afraid always have those who think the rules do not apply to them, their rights are being infringed.
The answer is quite simple. You either accept the restrictions that are applied or you do not travel.
If you lose your licence because you drink and drive you lose your licence and the right to drive. The same should apply to those who insist on doing their own thing on aircraft.
Now being banned from flying might just make some of these people rethink their ideas.
fwh
I'm just waiting for "hello, it's me, I'm on the plane" - I may have to be restrained!!!
FWH - you ask "why some people feel they are special cases", if you study the Great British Public carefully that isn't quite what's happening. They just go through life in a sort of gormless haze not paying attention to announcements or signs. Ever been in a public building when the fire alarm went off and seen how many people waited to be personally told to get out. Which brings me to one of my long standing ideas for all forms of transport - before they are allowed to buy a ticket they should have to take an aptitude test!!!
FWH - you ask "why some people feel they are special cases", if you study the Great British Public carefully that isn't quite what's happening. They just go through life in a sort of gormless haze not paying attention to announcements or signs. Ever been in a public building when the fire alarm went off and seen how many people waited to be personally told to get out. Which brings me to one of my long standing ideas for all forms of transport - before they are allowed to buy a ticket they should have to take an aptitude test!!!
before they are allowed to buy a ticket they should have to take an aptitude test!!!
Aircraft 85% empty - that'll be nice - until the airlines go bust !!
It is reported that the pilot of an Alitalia flight had to abort take off at Milan Airport last week, after he made three requests for mobile phones to be turned off when he noticed interference on the aircraft's navigation systems. Three passengers were arrested after allegedly refusing to comply with the pilot's requests .... click here for full story.
David
David
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