Below is the text of a letter sent in complaint to Thomsons, they have just replied saying that there are no grounds for a refund, although they will be acting on the points raised !!!!
They also hope that we will not be deterred from using Thomson again - FAT CHANCE!
Essentially, I guess I'd need to push for misrepresentation - am I flogging a dead horse?
Anyone know if the ASA standards apply to websites?
Dear Sirs,
I regretfully have to inform you that I feel the need to register a complaint regarding a component of my recent holiday to Sharm El Sheikh.
In booking this holiday, I intentionally restricted my search to your holidays that were still available with Premium Seating, even if this meant travelling to London Gatwick, instead of using my local, preferred airport of Bristol.
I was successful in finding a suitable holiday, and based on the information on your website I booked the holiday along with the upgraded seating.
I have attached the information that is provided on your website, which describes the benefits of the Premium Seating as:
"¢ Wider Seats with extra recline
"¢ Up to 5 inches extra legroom
The primary reason for booking this type of seat, is that both my wife and myself find the normal seats a little too narrow.
This extra cost option appeared to, according to your website, offer us the chance of a much more comfortable flight, so I happily paid the extra cost of £100.
When our tickets arrived, I was surprised to read that even though we had already paid for the Premium Seating, we still would have to pay £10 per person to pre-book the exact seats that we wanted.
In order to ensure suitable seating I immediately contacted your company, discussed our needs and booked seats 2A and 2B on the flight. This cost was an additional £20, in addition to the £100 already paid.
When pre-booking the seating, I made a point of stating that the reason we had purchased the seating upgrade was that due to our stature we found normal seats very uncomfortable. I also pointed out, that given our size we should probably not request exit seats. I was assured that the seats chosen were not exit seats, they were however the Premium Seats on the aircraft.
Reassured that we would have a more comfortable flight, we looked forward to our holiday.
Up until the point that we boarded the aircraft, we were very happy with our choice of holiday and tour operator.
When we saw our seat however, both my wife and myself were extremely concerned and disappointed.
Seats 2A and 2B are bulk head seats.
The sides of the seats are solid and are no wider than a normal seat, in fact there is much less room in the seat as the sides are solid to hold the tray table.
As to extra legroom, with the bulkhead in-front, it is impossible to straighten your legs out so in-fact there is LESS legroom in these seats than in a normal seat.
I truly cannot describe the discomfort that both my wife and myself experienced during that 5 hours flight, in fact we both suffered considerable bruising around the hip area.
I spoke to the Senior Cabin Crew member, and pointed out that the seats were extremely uncomfortable, and asked if all the Premium Seats were the same, i.e. behind a bulkhead. He confirmed that they were all the same.
We were clearly concerned with our Return Flight, as the thought of another 5 hours in agony was going to place a shadow over our holiday.
In an attempt to make alternate arrangements for the flight home, we contacted our In Resort Rep, "Ollie" at the earliest opportunity. He understood our plight immediately, since he had travelled in exactly the same seats on his outbound flight. He agreed that the seats were both narrower and had less leg room than a normal seat.
I requested that we be moved to normal seats for the return flight, since there was simply no way we could face sitting in those seats again.
Ollie assured us that "something" would be done, although despite several attempts to contact Operations, Ollie was unable to actually confirm that our seats had been changed.
Inevitably, we got to the end of our stay and we were taken to the airport for our return flight.
To be honest, I wasn't surprised to find that our seats had not been changed and we were still in 2A and 2B.
I explained our problems with our allocated seats to the check-in operator, and a supervisor explained that nothing could be done as all the seat allocations were finalised. He did promise that someone would "sort it out" for us at the Gate.
He then left the check-in area.
I am very pleased to say that the man on the check-in desk asked me for the original boarding cards back, ripped them up, and gave us two new ones for normal seats saying "it's no problem really, it is easy to fix".
We returned to the UK in normal seats, which whilst I can't say they were comfortable, they were considerably better than the Premium Seats we booked and paid extra for.
I strongly feel that we were misled at the time of booking the Premium Seats, indeed I feel your website details actually misrepresented them. I could have saved not only the £120 I spent on the seats, but also the additional cost of travel to and from Gatwick of £210 (being £270 less the cost of travel to Bristol of £60).
At the very least I feel it is only fair to expect a full cash refund of the additional amount paid to your company, of £120.
Additionally, I do not think it unreasonable to expect compensation for the considerable discomfort and distress caused by the whole episode.
I look forward to your response with interest.
Did you fill in a complaint form in resort re your disatissfaction with the seats?
You may be able to push them for the proportion of extra leg room you didnt use. ie your return journey.
If you go ahead with your claim for misinterpreation, good luck. Hopefully one of our flight experts will be able to help you with the rest of your question.
Kath HT Admin
You may be able to push them for the proportion of extra leg room you didnt use. ie your return journey.
If you go ahead with your claim for misinterpreation, good luck. Hopefully one of our flight experts will be able to help you with the rest of your question.
Kath HT Admin
We didn't fill in a complaint form in resort.
Even now, the website popup still describes the seats as set out above.
I am compliling a response, "rejecting their rejection", asking again for a refund before taking the matter further.
Simon
Even now, the website popup still describes the seats as set out above.
I am compliling a response, "rejecting their rejection", asking again for a refund before taking the matter further.
Simon
I'd have been upset as well - all that extra expense and travel - for what? Someone at Thomson's need to board the aircraft with a tape measure. 
Interesting thought.
Do I complain to the ASA that their website is misleading, which I believe it is.
People may not be aware, but the ASA only needs one complaint to investigate.
If my complaint to the ASA were to be upheld, Thomson would be forced to change their website.
Would this strengthen my case for a refund or for subsequent action?
Would this be best sent for arbitration (if so, to whom) or by direct legal action.
Simon
Do I complain to the ASA that their website is misleading, which I believe it is.
People may not be aware, but the ASA only needs one complaint to investigate.
If my complaint to the ASA were to be upheld, Thomson would be forced to change their website.
Would this strengthen my case for a refund or for subsequent action?
Would this be best sent for arbitration (if so, to whom) or by direct legal action.
Simon
OK - after more digging, it would appear that the ASA don't deal with claims or adverts on a companies own website.
For complaints against websites you simply go direct to your local Trading Standards.
At least that answers my previous question.
Simon
For complaints against websites you simply go direct to your local Trading Standards.
At least that answers my previous question.
Simon
I would take them to the small claims court and claim for pain and suffering as well as money back for the premium seats.
Just mention small claims court to them and you will sue for mis-reprepresentation and for pain and suffering, it will get their attention. It would of helped if you had taken photo's of the premium seats and the standard seats as evidence.
The letter you got is the first standard letter thomsons send out hoping you will just drop the claim, take no notice of it, but they will try again to fob you off but stick to your guns and see it through.
Just mention small claims court to them and you will sue for mis-reprepresentation and for pain and suffering, it will get their attention. It would of helped if you had taken photo's of the premium seats and the standard seats as evidence.
The letter you got is the first standard letter thomsons send out hoping you will just drop the claim, take no notice of it, but they will try again to fob you off but stick to your guns and see it through.
Perhaps I should just go straight to Trading Standards, they had a chance to make an offer.
Any thoughts?
Simon
Any thoughts?
Simon
Yes I would go to Trading Standards. They will tell you to write to the company if the first instance stating your case, which you have already done, so they will take it from there.
luci
luci
Well just back from the Post Office having written a second and final letter to Thomson "suggesting" they refund me.
In the meantime, I'll be contacting Trading Standards. Even if they refund me, I want them to be told to change their website to stop misleading their customers.
In the meantime, I'll be contacting Trading Standards. Even if they refund me, I want them to be told to change their website to stop misleading their customers.
Out of interest did you get the other facilities offered with premium service?
Like what Glynis?
We actually booked Extra Legroom seats, based on the description of such as set out in the first post.
It was the "pop up" that actually referred to them as Premium Seats.
Simon
We actually booked Extra Legroom seats, based on the description of such as set out in the first post.
It was the "pop up" that actually referred to them as Premium Seats.
Simon
Ah you initially said:-
That, plus the cost made me think you had booked premium seats. Am now totally confused at the costing here. Whenever I've booked extra legroom seats - which we always do - we choose our seats from the seating plan, we don't pay for extra leg room then pay to choose seats and £120 sounds expensive.
http://www.thomsonfly.com/en/flywithus_1878.html
I intentionally restricted my search to your holidays that were still available with Premium Seating, even if this meant travelling to London Gatwick, instead of using my local, preferred airport of Bristol.
That, plus the cost made me think you had booked premium seats. Am now totally confused at the costing here. Whenever I've booked extra legroom seats - which we always do - we choose our seats from the seating plan, we don't pay for extra leg room then pay to choose seats and £120 sounds expensive.
http://www.thomsonfly.com/en/flywithus_1878.html
I don't know if this will work, but to see what we actually booked and how the website describes the Extra Legroom Seats as Premium Seats when you open the information window.
If it works, click the link on the page "Extra legroom", a popup should appear.
If it doesn't work, just try booking a holiday to Sharm El Shiekh, leaving LGW on 20/4/2008 (far enough out to assure availability), select and continue on any holiday.
Here's an attempt to load the page:
http://www.thomson.co.uk/thomson/page/byo/booking/traveloptions.page
If it works, click the link on the page "Extra legroom", a popup should appear.
If it doesn't work, just try booking a holiday to Sharm El Shiekh, leaving LGW on 20/4/2008 (far enough out to assure availability), select and continue on any holiday.
Here's an attempt to load the page:
http://www.thomson.co.uk/thomson/page/byo/booking/traveloptions.page
On my flight out this year nobody was sitting in these seats so I asked to sit there & was allowed to do so for free (even having been told at checkin that it was possible to pay a one-way upgrade fee) and I have to admit they're definitely not as comfortable as proper premium seats should be (such as first choices which are excellent) and they are indeed narrower, but I somehow managed to just slump & throw my legs right forward and it was better than thomas cooks 29" old old boeing ones!
the price does seem excessive though. Keep bugging them because it's not fair that they can get away with this, so even if you don't get your money back, if you can get them to change their advertising as not to dupe others it would be a victory of sorts
the price does seem excessive though. Keep bugging them because it's not fair that they can get away with this, so even if you don't get your money back, if you can get them to change their advertising as not to dupe others it would be a victory of sorts
I've been back on their site and tried to book the holiday.......sure enough it mentions £50 per person for the extra leg room seats. I noticed it was a Thomsonfly flight so then went on to book a flight only to double check.
The following message came up:-
Now then I would read the above as meaning 'to guarantee that you all sit together' not pay £50 per person THEN you must pay another £20 to book seats together.
The following message came up:-
To guarantee that you all sit together, you can select prebookable seats for your party. This will apply to all passengers in your booking.
Price
Extra Leg Room £ 50.00 per adult return (not available for children)
If you have pre-booked two or more standard seats together, you can also request a window seat if these are available.
Now then I would read the above as meaning 'to guarantee that you all sit together' not pay £50 per person THEN you must pay another £20 to book seats together.
Did you click the words "Extra legroom" when booking the holiday, it then pops up a window describing what you get.
It doesn't do that if booking a flight only.
It doesn't do that if booking a flight only.
I think you might find you booked extra leg room seats ( even though you found the leg room wasn't extra at all)and not premium seats. Premium seats on flights to Egypt cost at least £120 return each. Premium seats are extra width and extra legroom and also include upgrades such as free drinks etc.
Regards Denny
Regards Denny
I thought you paid £100 per person extra and not £100 for both of you, premium seats would of cost more than that. If you didn't get the extra leg room and didn't get you are intitled to your money back. I never book to sit together, we always have sat together and I would imagine most people don't bother with paying to sit together.
Think about it if the seats are aloocated before you even get to the airport and for the return, they will sit families together. I think the sit together charge is the biggest rip off going. If one of was to be split up I am quite happy sitting anywhere, I just chat to who is next me.
What I like about thomson you can chose to have a window seat for free, this used to good when my kids were smaller, stopped arguments who would next to the window by requesting 2 window seats. I don't know why other t/ops don't do the same.
Think about it if the seats are aloocated before you even get to the airport and for the return, they will sit families together. I think the sit together charge is the biggest rip off going. If one of was to be split up I am quite happy sitting anywhere, I just chat to who is next me.
What I like about thomson you can chose to have a window seat for free, this used to good when my kids were smaller, stopped arguments who would next to the window by requesting 2 window seats. I don't know why other t/ops don't do the same.
I never booked seats together either till on the flight to Mexico on my honeymoon my new wife and I were split up so on longhaul now I always pay but I must admit on shorthaul I usually don't but obviously it's all down to how important it is to the people travelling.
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