I was also on the cancelled Manchester flight due to depart on 8th May and the delayed Paphos to Manchester flight on 15th May. I was totally appalled with the lack of communication from Excel Airlines and I was travelling with a 10 week old baby therefore I found it impossible to make notes and take Excel represtentative's names at the time to back up my complaint. As noone could confirm any details of the dealy I was worried sick whether I would have enough baby supplies for my son. The plane itinerary would have informed the airline that we were travelling with a young baby and no one provided any assistance whatsoever. The Excel staff were not interested when I asked if the buggies off the plane could be given priority and I did not receive my buggy in Gatwick until 10.30pm! We waited in the Hilton queue to check in for 3 hours! Not only did we lose over a day of our holiday but my husband lost a days pay due to the delay on the return flight. Myself and my son have been ill since our return so I have only been able to draft my complaint this week and will be posting it shortly. Could anyone let me know how they get on with their complaints especially if you booked flights only via Libra Holidays.
Just wondering what the latest is on this one.
We travelled Manchester Paphos on 11 May, Excel Airways, no problem. But we returned on the SUnday 22 May - and a lot of the other passengers in the check in queue had a two week holiday, so they had travelled out on the notorious 8th May flight.
Our return was delayed by about 3 hours -I got talking to a lot of the passengers who had flown out on the 8th, from Manchester, then via Gatwick.
My problem was on the return flight, they had an aircraft change. We paid £60 for extra leg room seats. Needless to say we didnt get them because of the aircraft change.
Any news from Excel? Frankly I cant be bothered trying to get our money back from the extra legroom seats. Seems like too much hassle!
We travelled Manchester Paphos on 11 May, Excel Airways, no problem. But we returned on the SUnday 22 May - and a lot of the other passengers in the check in queue had a two week holiday, so they had travelled out on the notorious 8th May flight.
Our return was delayed by about 3 hours -I got talking to a lot of the passengers who had flown out on the 8th, from Manchester, then via Gatwick.
My problem was on the return flight, they had an aircraft change. We paid £60 for extra leg room seats. Needless to say we didnt get them because of the aircraft change.
Any news from Excel? Frankly I cant be bothered trying to get our money back from the extra legroom seats. Seems like too much hassle!
Having read all of the previous posts regarding Excel Airways I am more convinced my experiences are far from unique. I cannot yet answer any previously posed question as I've only just lodged my complaint with Excel and also been informed of their 15 day response time.
Our small group (7 pax) arrived at m/cr airport for departure to Sanford with Travel City Direct (complete package of flight, accomm. and car) at 14:00 on Sunday 10th July. We were immed. informed of a delay and new dep. time would be 02:00am following day - a 12 hour delay.
We were told to check-in anyway and a couple of hours later (midday on Sunday) at the desk I asked for a copy of the passenger rights (EC261/2004) to be told there was no copy available.
Left with hand-luggage Excel requested we all return at 16:00 for further info. We travelled into m/cr city centre and had a lunch at a pub.
At 16:15 back in airport we were given vouchers for £5.00 each for the purchase of refreshments (voucher issued by Excel and may be used for on-board purchases also).
First attempt to use at the (only) food outlet open at m/cr Travel City Check-in area (near the train station) caused problems as both vouchers and cash not permitted whilst using only vouchers was - but no change given.
Very limited seating areas and soon informed by Excel to be available at 18:30 for transportation to a ocal hotel for a meal. At about 17:30 I asked and was told our plane had now left Sanford in Florida. With an approx. 8 hour flight-time and 2 hours (min.) to clean/re-provision a 747 I guessed we'd be lucky to depart at 2:00am and knew there'd be restrictions on both landing and take-off at night for a jumbo. Assured by Excel that written special permission had been granted to allow landing/take-off.
Took Excel quite a while to load several buses and coaches and our group left at about 18:40. 25 minute journey to a hotel, soup and buffet main/sweet (OK) then back to airport by about 21:00.
Then the fun started.
More vouchers given out (£3 each) about 22:30 and by now we've passed through passport control and in that 'no-mans land' so there's not many food/drink outlets still open. tried to purchase a beer for myself and friend using a voucher and this was refused. I asked to speak with management and the refusal was confirmed even though the voucher indicated no such restrictions. I was clearly threatened with police and refusal to board by 'being under the influence of alchohol'. Interestingly, by paying cash such 'influence' disappeared.
By midnight WHS (last open shop) was about to close so I tried to purchase three bottles of water with a £5 voucher. WHS refused to accept the voucher - I wrote my name and address on the reverse together with my phone number, left (with the water) and instructed them to sue me for the money.
An annoucement 5 minutes later confirmed WH Smith's acceptance of the vouchers against water - but they would be closing in 15 minutes.
The display screens had been showing a dep. time of 02:30 prior to midnight but at about midnight this changed to 'Info. next given at 02:30'.
Sure enough more bad news. Whilst the plane had landed it was evident that 3 wheels (or tyres) needed changing and the departure time would be further delayed.
The Excel rep. gave this announcement to an increasingly restive crowd of approx. 450 pax who had I believe behaved perfectly until that time. Armed police were very evident and I thought this insulting as the Excel rep. had been treated with courtesy throughout. Interestingly, that rep confirmed the duty manager (for Excel) had left for home and sleep.
We were moved to the gate area and then on to the plane at 02:45.
At 03:30 the captain announced a further 40 minute delay in order to load baggage. The noises below the now loaded plane were not those associated with baggage loading - rather, more those of changing wheels and or other mechanical work.
We pushed-back at 04:25, taxied at 04:35 left the ground at 04:45.
In all, a 14.5 hour delay.
With the limited food/drink outlets at Manchester we had £38.00 remaining in vouchers and in anticipation I'd asked the Excel rep. at Manchester to confirm thir validy for on-board duty-free purchases. This was confirmed.
However, no one bothered to inform the stewardesses. I had to complai quite forcefully - although politely - that as the vouchers stated no restrictions the phrase 'purchases on board the aircraft' meant exactly that. The chief stewardess acceded but explained that she and her fellow staff had voted prior to departure and it was a narrow margin in favour of flying - how very decent of Excel.
Arrival was uneventful, Dollar car collection smooth as ever.
We'd been assured at Manchester that upon our return home 14/15 days later a letter would be awaiting us from Excel and we should anyway claim from our travel insurance for the delay.
Naturally, no such letter available upon return. I rang Excel to remind them of the complaint I had already lodged (in writing) with their rep. at the gate in Manchester immed. prior to loading. They had no record of it even though my carbon copy was signed as received by the Excel rep. Excel also said my complaint should be taken up with Air Atlanta
as they were the carrier.
I've encountered Air Atlanta before when my Virgin Atlantic scheduled flight was changed over to Air Atlanta (Branson had just won the Manchester to Bombay route and moved his planes to serve this route) back in 2000. Their function in life appears to be renting planes to other carriers. Air Atlanta assured me my complaint lies with Excel as they were (are) responsible for the crew and the rostering.
The relationship between Travel City Direct, Air Atlanta and Excel seems complex and interwoven. There's a high probability that if you book with TCD you'll get to fly (eventuall) with Air Atlanta and be unfortunate enough to have an Excel Crew looking after you (if they vote to fly!).
I'm a couple of days into the 15 day response period from Excel and await with amusement their initial response. I've studied EC261/2004 and I'm fully aware of their obligations and they fell far short of the mandatory assistance that should have been provided for a flight that was lknown at the outset to be delayed for 12 hours and whose new departure date followed the original date (overnight accommodation is required in such circumstances - see article 9 (1) (b) and 9 (1) (c) ).
I've since enquired about Excel and Air Atlanta / TCD performance and I understand the Manchester passengers this last weekend (30/31 July) had an even worse experience. It is alleged that a TCD 747 scheduled to fly to Florida from M/cr was cancelled for 24 hours for technical reasons. That same plane however was able to take passengers from the same gate to Tenerife. The Florida pax were put up in hotels overnight flying out the next day.
Whilst I cannot be certain it is again alleged that Excel crews are 'rented out' just as Air Atlanta planes are hired/rented/loaded etc.
I've decided that I'll no longer book with TCD and will do everything within my power to avoid Air Atlanta and Excel. This is not as easy as it may sound however. Back in 2000 I'd booked my family with Virgin Atlantic (scheduled flight only) and my parents a couple of days later also with Virgin. Whilst we 4 flew Virgin my parents were switched to an Air Atlanta plane and hated the experience - they were given $50 each in cash on the plane as compensation.
We 4 flew back with Air Atlanta and for the first hour water was pouring on me from the lockers above. The crew were disinterested and claimed it was a leaking water bottle. It was found to be a faulty air conditioning unit. My father was take very ill in Florida and hospitalised - my parents flew back a few days after us, again with Air Atlanta.
Even Virgin is prepared to use Air Atlanta's services.
I'll update this comment should Excel's response and/or offer of reasonable compensation prove derisory.
Our small group (7 pax) arrived at m/cr airport for departure to Sanford with Travel City Direct (complete package of flight, accomm. and car) at 14:00 on Sunday 10th July. We were immed. informed of a delay and new dep. time would be 02:00am following day - a 12 hour delay.
We were told to check-in anyway and a couple of hours later (midday on Sunday) at the desk I asked for a copy of the passenger rights (EC261/2004) to be told there was no copy available.
Left with hand-luggage Excel requested we all return at 16:00 for further info. We travelled into m/cr city centre and had a lunch at a pub.
At 16:15 back in airport we were given vouchers for £5.00 each for the purchase of refreshments (voucher issued by Excel and may be used for on-board purchases also).
First attempt to use at the (only) food outlet open at m/cr Travel City Check-in area (near the train station) caused problems as both vouchers and cash not permitted whilst using only vouchers was - but no change given.
Very limited seating areas and soon informed by Excel to be available at 18:30 for transportation to a ocal hotel for a meal. At about 17:30 I asked and was told our plane had now left Sanford in Florida. With an approx. 8 hour flight-time and 2 hours (min.) to clean/re-provision a 747 I guessed we'd be lucky to depart at 2:00am and knew there'd be restrictions on both landing and take-off at night for a jumbo. Assured by Excel that written special permission had been granted to allow landing/take-off.
Took Excel quite a while to load several buses and coaches and our group left at about 18:40. 25 minute journey to a hotel, soup and buffet main/sweet (OK) then back to airport by about 21:00.
Then the fun started.
More vouchers given out (£3 each) about 22:30 and by now we've passed through passport control and in that 'no-mans land' so there's not many food/drink outlets still open. tried to purchase a beer for myself and friend using a voucher and this was refused. I asked to speak with management and the refusal was confirmed even though the voucher indicated no such restrictions. I was clearly threatened with police and refusal to board by 'being under the influence of alchohol'. Interestingly, by paying cash such 'influence' disappeared.
By midnight WHS (last open shop) was about to close so I tried to purchase three bottles of water with a £5 voucher. WHS refused to accept the voucher - I wrote my name and address on the reverse together with my phone number, left (with the water) and instructed them to sue me for the money.
An annoucement 5 minutes later confirmed WH Smith's acceptance of the vouchers against water - but they would be closing in 15 minutes.
The display screens had been showing a dep. time of 02:30 prior to midnight but at about midnight this changed to 'Info. next given at 02:30'.
Sure enough more bad news. Whilst the plane had landed it was evident that 3 wheels (or tyres) needed changing and the departure time would be further delayed.
The Excel rep. gave this announcement to an increasingly restive crowd of approx. 450 pax who had I believe behaved perfectly until that time. Armed police were very evident and I thought this insulting as the Excel rep. had been treated with courtesy throughout. Interestingly, that rep confirmed the duty manager (for Excel) had left for home and sleep.
We were moved to the gate area and then on to the plane at 02:45.
At 03:30 the captain announced a further 40 minute delay in order to load baggage. The noises below the now loaded plane were not those associated with baggage loading - rather, more those of changing wheels and or other mechanical work.
We pushed-back at 04:25, taxied at 04:35 left the ground at 04:45.
In all, a 14.5 hour delay.
With the limited food/drink outlets at Manchester we had £38.00 remaining in vouchers and in anticipation I'd asked the Excel rep. at Manchester to confirm thir validy for on-board duty-free purchases. This was confirmed.
However, no one bothered to inform the stewardesses. I had to complai quite forcefully - although politely - that as the vouchers stated no restrictions the phrase 'purchases on board the aircraft' meant exactly that. The chief stewardess acceded but explained that she and her fellow staff had voted prior to departure and it was a narrow margin in favour of flying - how very decent of Excel.
Arrival was uneventful, Dollar car collection smooth as ever.
We'd been assured at Manchester that upon our return home 14/15 days later a letter would be awaiting us from Excel and we should anyway claim from our travel insurance for the delay.
Naturally, no such letter available upon return. I rang Excel to remind them of the complaint I had already lodged (in writing) with their rep. at the gate in Manchester immed. prior to loading. They had no record of it even though my carbon copy was signed as received by the Excel rep. Excel also said my complaint should be taken up with Air Atlanta
as they were the carrier.I've encountered Air Atlanta before when my Virgin Atlantic scheduled flight was changed over to Air Atlanta (Branson had just won the Manchester to Bombay route and moved his planes to serve this route) back in 2000. Their function in life appears to be renting planes to other carriers. Air Atlanta assured me my complaint lies with Excel as they were (are) responsible for the crew and the rostering.
The relationship between Travel City Direct, Air Atlanta and Excel seems complex and interwoven. There's a high probability that if you book with TCD you'll get to fly (eventuall) with Air Atlanta and be unfortunate enough to have an Excel Crew looking after you (if they vote to fly!).
I'm a couple of days into the 15 day response period from Excel and await with amusement their initial response. I've studied EC261/2004 and I'm fully aware of their obligations and they fell far short of the mandatory assistance that should have been provided for a flight that was lknown at the outset to be delayed for 12 hours and whose new departure date followed the original date (overnight accommodation is required in such circumstances - see article 9 (1) (b) and 9 (1) (c) ).
I've since enquired about Excel and Air Atlanta / TCD performance and I understand the Manchester passengers this last weekend (30/31 July) had an even worse experience. It is alleged that a TCD 747 scheduled to fly to Florida from M/cr was cancelled for 24 hours for technical reasons. That same plane however was able to take passengers from the same gate to Tenerife. The Florida pax were put up in hotels overnight flying out the next day.
Whilst I cannot be certain it is again alleged that Excel crews are 'rented out' just as Air Atlanta planes are hired/rented/loaded etc.
I've decided that I'll no longer book with TCD and will do everything within my power to avoid Air Atlanta and Excel. This is not as easy as it may sound however. Back in 2000 I'd booked my family with Virgin Atlantic (scheduled flight only) and my parents a couple of days later also with Virgin. Whilst we 4 flew Virgin my parents were switched to an Air Atlanta plane and hated the experience - they were given $50 each in cash on the plane as compensation.
We 4 flew back with Air Atlanta and for the first hour water was pouring on me from the lockers above. The crew were disinterested and claimed it was a leaking water bottle. It was found to be a faulty air conditioning unit. My father was take very ill in Florida and hospitalised - my parents flew back a few days after us, again with Air Atlanta.
Even Virgin is prepared to use Air Atlanta's services.
I'll update this comment should Excel's response and/or offer of reasonable compensation prove derisory.
Hi Mike;
I shouldn't hold your breath if I were you over the compensation thing!
We were on the 27 hour Paphos delayed/cancelled flight outbound 8 hour delay inbound flight and have now been awarded some compensation from Excel.
The total amount offered for the two of us was £17.15 each.
This doesn't even cover 1 hour's wage for me for the day that I couldn't go into work when we returned home; let alone any compensation for missing the wedding of our friends.
I have now written off to the Air Transport Users Council. There details are:
Air Transport Users Council
CAA House
45/59 Kingsway
London
WC2B 6TE
If I were you, I'd write now as it took them 3 weeks to acknowledge my letter; they are apparently are over whelmed with the number of complaints since then new EU regulations. ANy it may take upt 8 weeks for them to investigate.
If this fails for me to be awarded a fair compensation - I'm not after making a quick buck - I want what I feel I am entitled to, I will start proceedings in the small claims court. I will not let this company bully me, ignore my letters and let them think that the problem has gone away!
Good Luck
Steve
I shouldn't hold your breath if I were you over the compensation thing!
We were on the 27 hour Paphos delayed/cancelled flight outbound 8 hour delay inbound flight and have now been awarded some compensation from Excel.
The total amount offered for the two of us was £17.15 each.
This doesn't even cover 1 hour's wage for me for the day that I couldn't go into work when we returned home; let alone any compensation for missing the wedding of our friends.
I have now written off to the Air Transport Users Council. There details are:
Air Transport Users Council
CAA House
45/59 Kingsway
London
WC2B 6TE
If I were you, I'd write now as it took them 3 weeks to acknowledge my letter; they are apparently are over whelmed with the number of complaints since then new EU regulations. ANy it may take upt 8 weeks for them to investigate.
If this fails for me to be awarded a fair compensation - I'm not after making a quick buck - I want what I feel I am entitled to, I will start proceedings in the small claims court. I will not let this company bully me, ignore my letters and let them think that the problem has gone away!
Good Luck
Steve
Hi Jinko
How are you getting on with your complaint with Excel? Im going through the same process at the moment. My next step will be a travel lawyer,and the Sunday Times Travel Section this Sunday (7th August) will have an article about Excel airways and compensation and what i have or have not experienced. I also agree with another contributor to this thread that on our flight with Excel the Captain probably said three words and the air hostesses were so bad tempered and the plane was dirty. I refuse to give up as they were the ones who said we were entitled to compensation in the first place!
How are you getting on with your complaint with Excel? Im going through the same process at the moment. My next step will be a travel lawyer,and the Sunday Times Travel Section this Sunday (7th August) will have an article about Excel airways and compensation and what i have or have not experienced. I also agree with another contributor to this thread that on our flight with Excel the Captain probably said three words and the air hostesses were so bad tempered and the plane was dirty. I refuse to give up as they were the ones who said we were entitled to compensation in the first place!
Update: As far as i know the Sunday Times Travel Section will now not be pub;ishing their article on Excel as Excel have now turned around and said they will compensate us. I will do a thread on this this weekend.
I am over the moon, as I have been fighting with Excel over the compensation for the delayed 27hour delayed flight and eventually got the AUC Air Transport User Council involved.
After 5 months of going backwards and forwards, Excel have now agreed that we were denied boarding on the flight and have subsequently offered to pay me compensation amounting to £556.00 for the two of us.
If anyone else out there wants to get back what is duly owed to them, contact excel again, tell them that you are aware they have now classed this flight as denied boarding and under the EU regulations, they must pay you 400euro per passenger.
Good luck! Let me know how you get on!
Steve
[/u]
After 5 months of going backwards and forwards, Excel have now agreed that we were denied boarding on the flight and have subsequently offered to pay me compensation amounting to £556.00 for the two of us.
If anyone else out there wants to get back what is duly owed to them, contact excel again, tell them that you are aware they have now classed this flight as denied boarding and under the EU regulations, they must pay you 400euro per passenger.
Good luck! Let me know how you get on!
Steve
[/u]
We were bumped off a flight (no. 2067) from Dalaman to Manchester on the 1st Oct. because the aircraft was too small and had insufficient capacity for the passengers booked on this flight. With the help of Turkish airport staff (Not Excel staff, none were available) we managed to get seats on a Monarch flight some hours later to Gatwick. We were told that Excel would reimburse the cost of our domestic flight from Gatwick to Manchester. We wrote to Excel on 3rd October enclosing all receipts for domestic flight to Manchester asking for a refund. No response from Excel, we wrote again on 3rd November, received a reply from Excel on 16th November saying sorry for the delay and that our correspondence will be passed to head office for them to provide "a speedy conclusion to our concerns". It's now 14th January and still nothing heard.
I understand there is an EEC ruling regarding compensation for being bumped off a flight and that Excel may well be in breach of this. I would like to hear from anyone who has pursued similar Excel issues through the courts. Clearly they have not responded to me within a reasonable time frame.
I understand there is an EEC ruling regarding compensation for being bumped off a flight and that Excel may well be in breach of this. I would like to hear from anyone who has pursued similar Excel issues through the courts. Clearly they have not responded to me within a reasonable time frame.
I found excel to be the most unhelpful company to ever deal with. I received various letters from Excel regarding my fight for compensation which were very contradictory to say the least - infact the involved Freedom flights at one point and I have no idea where they were involved.
I would suggest that you write to the AUC (Air Transport Users Council) CAA House, 45/59 Kingsway, London WC2B 6TE. They are there to protect and assist the likes of you and I and will not make any charge for investigating your situation.
Don't be prepared for a quick reply though! When I first contacted them they advised me that due to the new EU regulations, they had been inundated with request from people who needed help. But, with the assistance and their communication with Excel, Excel have now awarded us £556 for denying us / cancelling a flight that we were on from Manchester to Cyprus.
My advice is to keep on chasing. All to often, the likes of these air companies take the view that they will "fob you off" and you will forget about it. Initally, Excel offered me £17.15 compensation for the denied boarding of the flight. So it turned out to be very much worth my time and effort to persue it and I suggest that you do the same.
I would suggest that you write to the AUC (Air Transport Users Council) CAA House, 45/59 Kingsway, London WC2B 6TE. They are there to protect and assist the likes of you and I and will not make any charge for investigating your situation.
Don't be prepared for a quick reply though! When I first contacted them they advised me that due to the new EU regulations, they had been inundated with request from people who needed help. But, with the assistance and their communication with Excel, Excel have now awarded us £556 for denying us / cancelling a flight that we were on from Manchester to Cyprus.
My advice is to keep on chasing. All to often, the likes of these air companies take the view that they will "fob you off" and you will forget about it. Initally, Excel offered me £17.15 compensation for the denied boarding of the flight. So it turned out to be very much worth my time and effort to persue it and I suggest that you do the same.
Richard,
you are quite roght, there is strengthened EU rules specifically governing your case - "bumped" off a flight.
The amount of compensation depends upon the distance the flight was scheduled to travel. The upper limit is about £415 but that would apply to long-haul. I'd guess you lie in the mid range (flight distance between 1500 and 3500 km - 400 euros about £275).
The airline should first have asked for volunteers to give up their seats. These may negotiate with the airline to seek acceptable compensation. In addition, the passenger may look for an alternate flight (original carrier pays this flight cost) or seek a refund of their flight cost from the original carrier.
If insufficient volunteers come forward, the carrier may forcibly 'bump' passengers but must compensate to the stated amounts (between 250-600 euros depending upon length of flight). They must also be offered an alternate flight or refund of their ticket. In addition, overnight accommodation may be sought if waiting for an alternative flight next day. Meals and refreshments and access to a telephone must also be provided in reasonable proportion to the length of the delay.
So, there's no if or buts, Excel have a requirement under EC law to pay you the compensation amount commensurate with the length of your flight (Dalaman to Manchester) and to either refund you the cost of the flight with them or repay your alternate flight cost - you choose. If you have receipts for reasonable meal/drinks/accomm. expenses they must refund these also.
Write to Excel pointing this out (regulation EC261/2004) .
You could first ring 00800 6 7 8 9 10 11 - this is the European Direct Freephone and they will then point you in the right direction. Or email them on mail@europe-direct.cec.eu.int and ask for contact details of the body enforcing these details in the UK.
If Excel fail to repay you email tren-aprights@cec.eu.int and explain the matter to them. They should then force Excel to comply. First, though, email Excel withthis knowledge and tell them that all costs you bear in recovering your compensation will be borne by them, together with an EU imposed fines for non-compliance. give them 7 days to respond and refund otherwise pursue with all vigour.
The law is on you side here.
Excel Contact Details
01293 440002
fax: 01293 440006
email: xla@airlinecrm.com
Let us know how you progress.
Mike
you are quite roght, there is strengthened EU rules specifically governing your case - "bumped" off a flight.
The amount of compensation depends upon the distance the flight was scheduled to travel. The upper limit is about £415 but that would apply to long-haul. I'd guess you lie in the mid range (flight distance between 1500 and 3500 km - 400 euros about £275).
The airline should first have asked for volunteers to give up their seats. These may negotiate with the airline to seek acceptable compensation. In addition, the passenger may look for an alternate flight (original carrier pays this flight cost) or seek a refund of their flight cost from the original carrier.
If insufficient volunteers come forward, the carrier may forcibly 'bump' passengers but must compensate to the stated amounts (between 250-600 euros depending upon length of flight). They must also be offered an alternate flight or refund of their ticket. In addition, overnight accommodation may be sought if waiting for an alternative flight next day. Meals and refreshments and access to a telephone must also be provided in reasonable proportion to the length of the delay.
So, there's no if or buts, Excel have a requirement under EC law to pay you the compensation amount commensurate with the length of your flight (Dalaman to Manchester) and to either refund you the cost of the flight with them or repay your alternate flight cost - you choose. If you have receipts for reasonable meal/drinks/accomm. expenses they must refund these also.
Write to Excel pointing this out (regulation EC261/2004) .
You could first ring 00800 6 7 8 9 10 11 - this is the European Direct Freephone and they will then point you in the right direction. Or email them on mail@europe-direct.cec.eu.int and ask for contact details of the body enforcing these details in the UK.
If Excel fail to repay you email tren-aprights@cec.eu.int and explain the matter to them. They should then force Excel to comply. First, though, email Excel withthis knowledge and tell them that all costs you bear in recovering your compensation will be borne by them, together with an EU imposed fines for non-compliance. give them 7 days to respond and refund otherwise pursue with all vigour.
The law is on you side here.
Excel Contact Details
01293 440002
fax: 01293 440006
email: xla@airlinecrm.com
Let us know how you progress.
Mike
Thanks Steve and Mike for your postings regarding my experience with Excel. Both of these were most helpful and I am in the process of gathering the information you mention. Interestingly I have just received a letter from Excel in response to mine of the 3rd November, not bad only two months one week for a so-called prompt response.
On reading the letter I am convinced they have totally lost the plot. My partner and I did manage to secure a flight with Monarch to Gatwick because nothing was available to Manchester our original destination. We were the only two people of those bumped by Excel to get on this flight. However, in Excel's reply to me, they refer to having laid on a coach to transfer all those Excel passengers who took a Monarch Gatwick flight supposedly to take them back to Manchester. One thing I know for certain, there were no other Excel passengers on our Monarch flight back to Gatwick. They said they have investigated our circumstances surrounding our flight; I hasten to add that they have copies of our Monarch boarding cards and flight number. I can only assume that there investigation process also need investigation as they have got it totally wrong. Monarch was very good; boarding us at the very last moment and taking the trouble to ensure our baggage was stowed. They did apologise that they would not be able to offer us an in-flight meal because they only had sufficient for there own passengers, not a problem we were grateful for the flight home. Excel's closing paragraph reads, "In closing we remain sympathetic towards your displeasure, and even though we cannot provide compensation, we hope to have clarified our position". My reaction is that they need to take a second look at the facts and clarify their own position and procedures for investigating customer related issues. After over two months I would at the very least expect their response to be based upon accurate information.
On reading the letter I am convinced they have totally lost the plot. My partner and I did manage to secure a flight with Monarch to Gatwick because nothing was available to Manchester our original destination. We were the only two people of those bumped by Excel to get on this flight. However, in Excel's reply to me, they refer to having laid on a coach to transfer all those Excel passengers who took a Monarch Gatwick flight supposedly to take them back to Manchester. One thing I know for certain, there were no other Excel passengers on our Monarch flight back to Gatwick. They said they have investigated our circumstances surrounding our flight; I hasten to add that they have copies of our Monarch boarding cards and flight number. I can only assume that there investigation process also need investigation as they have got it totally wrong. Monarch was very good; boarding us at the very last moment and taking the trouble to ensure our baggage was stowed. They did apologise that they would not be able to offer us an in-flight meal because they only had sufficient for there own passengers, not a problem we were grateful for the flight home. Excel's closing paragraph reads, "In closing we remain sympathetic towards your displeasure, and even though we cannot provide compensation, we hope to have clarified our position". My reaction is that they need to take a second look at the facts and clarify their own position and procedures for investigating customer related issues. After over two months I would at the very least expect their response to be based upon accurate information.
Richard,
small claims court. You'll win. They are in breach of EC261/2004. If you need confirmation of that ring Ros on 01922 621114
Good Luck.
Mike
small claims court. You'll win. They are in breach of EC261/2004. If you need confirmation of that ring Ros on 01922 621114
Good Luck.
Mike
We were due to depart from Gatwick at 09:15 on 28 April 2006. We arrived at the airport at a little before 06:00. When we arrived at the check-in desk there was nothing on the screen so we decided to walk and check back soon. A little while later an announcement was made over the loud speaker that passengers awaiting flight XL852 should arrive at the desk at 07:00 for further information. We went down to see what was happening straight away. Already there were a few distraught passengers and staff told us that there were 'technical difficulties' and that it looked as if we would be coached up to Manchester to catch the flight from there. I had researched Excel Airways after they failed to deliver my tickets and were unhelpful and lacking in any customer care skills; therefore, I had been warned due to a barrage of complaints online that 'technical difficulties' happened often and matters were not looking too promising.
Upon arrival at 07:00 a long queue had formed and no staff members were visible. Eventually, people started approaching the desk and the queue went down. We were all handed a letter stating that we would be coached up to Manchester to meet the flight there at 14:00. I asked the member of staff to confirm that the flight would definitely wait for us and she replied that they certainly would as there was over 100 of us. We received a £5 food coupon each.
As we reached the coach (we were to depart at half seven but left an hour later) we were beginning to wonder if we would all fit on. We asked the staff member this question and she said she hoped so as it held 80 people"¦?! This was the same lady that told us there were over 100 of us. Sure enough, we were further delayed as they arranged taxis for the overspill.
We arrived by coach at Manchester airport 5 hours later, dead on 14:00. However, as we arrived there was a member of staff waiting to inform us that there never was a flight departing at 14:00, instead we would have to wait until 20:30! We were given another letter. They checked in our bags, although under the label of flight 'Test', and we were given a further £5 food coupon each.
Manchester airport was very quiet. We were left wondering what had happened to all the passengers we were due to pick up, had there ever been a plane, or had they left without us, and would we definitely leave that night? When talking to Excel representatives all we received were lies and hostility, when we were behaving perfectly well under the circumstances. I phoned through to Excel headquarters and spoke to a supervisor who informed me she was disgusted at how we had been treated and would call me back when she knew what was happening. However, when she called me back about 15 minutes later she was abrupt, citing technical difficulties, and said she knew no more. From the change of tone in her voice and manner I was left feeling as though she had been hushed up.
Later that day we were told that we would be escorted to the Radisson SAS for dinner before returning to catch the flight later. The food was appalling and embarrassing, and once more no representatives could be found.
Just gone 20:00 hours we were told over the airport loud speaker that we would not be flying that night and to report for check-in at the Radisson Hotel. The dismay was highly audible. Everyone descended on the customer information desk but all the Excel representatives had gone into hiding and were nowhere to be found. People were crying and screaming and to calm us down they sent in armed police!!! We were told to collect our bags (some of which they had managed to lose although no-one had ever left the terminal!) and go straight to the hotel where a representative would meet us at 22:00 hours. We checked in and went to meet the representative.
It was chaos in the lobby, and the gentleman was very good at his job, but he told us that he could not account for what had happened earlier in the day as he was not on duty, but that Excel had paid Monarch to fly us out at 09:00 the next day. We were sent off to bed with another letter for another early start in the morning.
Check in went well the next day and we received more coupons for breakfast. We boarded the plane no more than one hour later. However, the pilot soon informed us that they were having difficulties with their navigational equipment. We were sat on that plane for four hours before take off, with only a glass of water each. Excel representatives arrived but refused to speak to passengers and refused to give us their names. They hid in the cockpit talking to the cabin crew and got the hostesses to relay the information to us. They were cowards, so much so that they had police board the plane to escort them and keep us away! By this time we were all disgusted at their treatment of us.
Just before the end of our wait the captain announced that if was looking as though they would have to cancel the flight and he would understand if most of us choose to abandon our journey. We were refused exit from the plane though by staff. Just as we were about to walk off the captain announced that we would be leaving. We took off at 13:00 that day, 28 hours late.
Six days later, as we approached Grantley Adams Airport to make our return journey we told ourselves that nothing could possibly go wrong, but we were mistaken. We asked the representative when we could check-in as we were departing at 16:30 that evening. She told us 'not now you're not', the flight had been delayed leaving England and we were looking at a 6 hour delay. We were dismayed. This time we were given a BDS$30 coupon each.
Sure enough, the flight arrived six hours later. We took off at 22:30. We had been upgraded, but all that meant was a free drink, a bit more leg room, and some complimentary socks"¦ not much to make up for losing a day of our holiday (when we were only going for a week), spending 40 hours waiting around in airports, and being treated appallingly.
I will never fly Excel again, and I will ensure that everyone else I ever come into contact with never flies with them either.
Upon arrival at 07:00 a long queue had formed and no staff members were visible. Eventually, people started approaching the desk and the queue went down. We were all handed a letter stating that we would be coached up to Manchester to meet the flight there at 14:00. I asked the member of staff to confirm that the flight would definitely wait for us and she replied that they certainly would as there was over 100 of us. We received a £5 food coupon each.
As we reached the coach (we were to depart at half seven but left an hour later) we were beginning to wonder if we would all fit on. We asked the staff member this question and she said she hoped so as it held 80 people"¦?! This was the same lady that told us there were over 100 of us. Sure enough, we were further delayed as they arranged taxis for the overspill.
We arrived by coach at Manchester airport 5 hours later, dead on 14:00. However, as we arrived there was a member of staff waiting to inform us that there never was a flight departing at 14:00, instead we would have to wait until 20:30! We were given another letter. They checked in our bags, although under the label of flight 'Test', and we were given a further £5 food coupon each.
Manchester airport was very quiet. We were left wondering what had happened to all the passengers we were due to pick up, had there ever been a plane, or had they left without us, and would we definitely leave that night? When talking to Excel representatives all we received were lies and hostility, when we were behaving perfectly well under the circumstances. I phoned through to Excel headquarters and spoke to a supervisor who informed me she was disgusted at how we had been treated and would call me back when she knew what was happening. However, when she called me back about 15 minutes later she was abrupt, citing technical difficulties, and said she knew no more. From the change of tone in her voice and manner I was left feeling as though she had been hushed up.
Later that day we were told that we would be escorted to the Radisson SAS for dinner before returning to catch the flight later. The food was appalling and embarrassing, and once more no representatives could be found.
Just gone 20:00 hours we were told over the airport loud speaker that we would not be flying that night and to report for check-in at the Radisson Hotel. The dismay was highly audible. Everyone descended on the customer information desk but all the Excel representatives had gone into hiding and were nowhere to be found. People were crying and screaming and to calm us down they sent in armed police!!! We were told to collect our bags (some of which they had managed to lose although no-one had ever left the terminal!) and go straight to the hotel where a representative would meet us at 22:00 hours. We checked in and went to meet the representative.
It was chaos in the lobby, and the gentleman was very good at his job, but he told us that he could not account for what had happened earlier in the day as he was not on duty, but that Excel had paid Monarch to fly us out at 09:00 the next day. We were sent off to bed with another letter for another early start in the morning.
Check in went well the next day and we received more coupons for breakfast. We boarded the plane no more than one hour later. However, the pilot soon informed us that they were having difficulties with their navigational equipment. We were sat on that plane for four hours before take off, with only a glass of water each. Excel representatives arrived but refused to speak to passengers and refused to give us their names. They hid in the cockpit talking to the cabin crew and got the hostesses to relay the information to us. They were cowards, so much so that they had police board the plane to escort them and keep us away! By this time we were all disgusted at their treatment of us.
Just before the end of our wait the captain announced that if was looking as though they would have to cancel the flight and he would understand if most of us choose to abandon our journey. We were refused exit from the plane though by staff. Just as we were about to walk off the captain announced that we would be leaving. We took off at 13:00 that day, 28 hours late.
Six days later, as we approached Grantley Adams Airport to make our return journey we told ourselves that nothing could possibly go wrong, but we were mistaken. We asked the representative when we could check-in as we were departing at 16:30 that evening. She told us 'not now you're not', the flight had been delayed leaving England and we were looking at a 6 hour delay. We were dismayed. This time we were given a BDS$30 coupon each.
Sure enough, the flight arrived six hours later. We took off at 22:30. We had been upgraded, but all that meant was a free drink, a bit more leg room, and some complimentary socks"¦ not much to make up for losing a day of our holiday (when we were only going for a week), spending 40 hours waiting around in airports, and being treated appallingly.
I will never fly Excel again, and I will ensure that everyone else I ever come into contact with never flies with them either.
Sarah Jane,
thankyou for an excellent post. Clear, concise although horrendous.
I despair of Excel. Your story, whilst far worse than my problems of last July mirrors their indifference and downright disregard for their customers.
Need to check with you first. Was it a package that you booked with a Tour Operator - Travel City Direct for example and you booked both the flight and the accommodation ? Was it a flight only with Excel and you booked your own accomm. privately ?
If you booked a package with a Tour Op. you have a valid claim against them for the refund of one seventh of your ENTIRE holiday package price on the basis that you lost one day of the holiday due to late departure. This precedence was set in court a couple of years ago in a case against Kuoni. You should also request £50 per passenger for distress, hassle etc.
In addition, the carrier (Excel) has a duty of care towards you covered under the EC261/2004 charter. This requires that they provide you with a written copy of your rights under that agreement. You should be provided with refreshements, food and if appropriate, accommodation. You are also entitled to one or two free phone calls, emails, texts or faxes.
It appears thet may have provided the bre necessities in this area - although Excel just love to give vouchers which can be hard to use - especially late at night in M/cr airport - I know from bitter experience. Just as an aside, I got Excel HQ's phone agreement to use the remaining vouchers for duty-free purchases on the outbound flight. The stewardess had a fit - but I got the 4 bottles.
If you booked a flight only with Excel you also have grounds for compensation. They cancelled the flight and did so after the scheduled take-off time. This merits compensation on a sliding scale dependant mainly upon the duration of the cancelled flight. I believe you'd be in line for about £415 per passenger.
They cannot claim the transfer to another carrier (Monarch) is simply a continuance of the original flight. The critical element here is the flight number. It differed from the one you booked - so it IS a different flight - hence the original has been cancelled.
You have what I'd consider to be a perfect claim - irrespective of having booked a package or a flight only.
Please let us know the answer to the package/flight only question and I can suggest how to proceed from there.
Mike
thankyou for an excellent post. Clear, concise although horrendous.
I despair of Excel. Your story, whilst far worse than my problems of last July mirrors their indifference and downright disregard for their customers.
Need to check with you first. Was it a package that you booked with a Tour Operator - Travel City Direct for example and you booked both the flight and the accommodation ? Was it a flight only with Excel and you booked your own accomm. privately ?
If you booked a package with a Tour Op. you have a valid claim against them for the refund of one seventh of your ENTIRE holiday package price on the basis that you lost one day of the holiday due to late departure. This precedence was set in court a couple of years ago in a case against Kuoni. You should also request £50 per passenger for distress, hassle etc.
In addition, the carrier (Excel) has a duty of care towards you covered under the EC261/2004 charter. This requires that they provide you with a written copy of your rights under that agreement. You should be provided with refreshements, food and if appropriate, accommodation. You are also entitled to one or two free phone calls, emails, texts or faxes.
It appears thet may have provided the bre necessities in this area - although Excel just love to give vouchers which can be hard to use - especially late at night in M/cr airport - I know from bitter experience. Just as an aside, I got Excel HQ's phone agreement to use the remaining vouchers for duty-free purchases on the outbound flight. The stewardess had a fit - but I got the 4 bottles.
If you booked a flight only with Excel you also have grounds for compensation. They cancelled the flight and did so after the scheduled take-off time. This merits compensation on a sliding scale dependant mainly upon the duration of the cancelled flight. I believe you'd be in line for about £415 per passenger.
They cannot claim the transfer to another carrier (Monarch) is simply a continuance of the original flight. The critical element here is the flight number. It differed from the one you booked - so it IS a different flight - hence the original has been cancelled.
You have what I'd consider to be a perfect claim - irrespective of having booked a package or a flight only.
Please let us know the answer to the package/flight only question and I can suggest how to proceed from there.
Mike
Wheras I think Mike is right in quite a most of his post you may have trouble claiming compensation for a cancelled flight. The flight from gatwick was cancelled for technical reasons which doesnt result in compensation unless you can prove there were no technical problems. the sliding scale compensation is for overbooking and purely cancelling flights for commercial reasons, weather and technical problems are excluded.
The journey sounds terrible and certainly would suggest persuing further.
Kind Regards
Stewart
The journey sounds terrible and certainly would suggest persuing further.
Kind Regards
Stewart
Mike, thank you for your comments - we booked the flights directly with Excel and I will certainly try and claim for cancellation. Everytime I asked for a copy of my rights they came up with excuses too, and I believe the fact that they failed to provide them is illegal.
You said that our flight out eventually had a different number - any chance you know what that was?
Also, anyone out there that experienced the horrors of flight XL852 on 28 April 2006, please contact the press link at the top of this page - they are very interested in our story... Especially the lady with the mobile phone video footage!
You said that our flight out eventually had a different number - any chance you know what that was?
Also, anyone out there that experienced the horrors of flight XL852 on 28 April 2006, please contact the press link at the top of this page - they are very interested in our story... Especially the lady with the mobile phone video footage!
Thanks Stewart, I'd missed the point about technical reasons.
I've had a closer look at the EC261/2004 document and article 4 point 3 makes reference to cancellation caused by
Article 5, point 1, subclause c refers to cancellation and the need to compensate the passengers point (iii) particularly refers to being informed of the cancellation withing 7 days of departure, offered re-routing, allowing arrival less than 2 hours after original scheduled arrival time.
It looks like the compensation hinges upon the interpretation of extraordinary circumstances that could not have been avoided even if ALL reasonable measures had been taken.
I personally think an aircraft breakdown or a crew out of hours is not extraordinary. I'm not saying these were the reasons given - in fact, were any SPECIFIC reasons given by Excel.
Sarah Jane, I would in the first instance write to Excel and ask for a clear, written reason as to the cause of the original cancellation.
Excel Contact Details
01293 440002
fax: 01293 440006
email: xla@airlinecrm.com
If you are unhappy about this reason given, contact the following:
AUC (Air Transport Users Council)
CAA House,
45/59 Kingsway,
London
WC2B 6TE
Provide them with the original flight number and ask them to confirm why Excel cancelled. I'd guess Excel will be required to furnish this body with the real reason.
Then seek legal advice as to how reasonable this is when judged against the clear wording in the EC261/2004 act and particulary as the responsibility lies with the air carrier to PROVE the reason was unavoidable.
IMO, a technical fault should be anticipated and spare aircraft or aircraft able to be "rented" at fairly short notice should be available. PLanes are complex machines prone to breaking down - that's why they are regularly serviced. Breakdowns should be expected.
IMO, crew out of hours is anticipatable - that's why they have rosters. The need to have more available crews is obvious and hardly unexpected.
Aircraft out of position, again, IMO, this becomes known when the aircraft fails to leave it's distant airport on it's journey towards the pick-up point. For example, a plane flying from Barbados to Gatwick fails to leave Barbados and is unlikely to do so for a number of hours. The flight time of, say 10 hours means this fact becomes known to Gatwick probably a minimum of 12 hours before that planes next departure. How much time does it take to obtain a replacement aircraft. If the answer is more than 12 hours then insufficient spare craft are available and providing more would overcome the problem - this problem is therefore forseeable.
It would be interesting to know what happened to the aircraft that was supposed to fly you originally. Did it later fly ? If so, where to and at what time did it take-off ? The AUC may be able to answer these questions because I'm sure Excel will not unless it's in court.
Push it Sarah - Ros Fernihough will advise 01922 621114.
Thanks, Stewart for the reminder.
Mike
I've had a closer look at the EC261/2004 document and article 4 point 3 makes reference to cancellation caused by
"extraordinary circumstances that could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken".
Article 5, point 1, subclause c refers to cancellation and the need to compensate the passengers point (iii) particularly refers to being informed of the cancellation withing 7 days of departure, offered re-routing, allowing arrival less than 2 hours after original scheduled arrival time.
It looks like the compensation hinges upon the interpretation of extraordinary circumstances that could not have been avoided even if ALL reasonable measures had been taken.
I personally think an aircraft breakdown or a crew out of hours is not extraordinary. I'm not saying these were the reasons given - in fact, were any SPECIFIC reasons given by Excel.
Sarah Jane, I would in the first instance write to Excel and ask for a clear, written reason as to the cause of the original cancellation.
Excel Contact Details
01293 440002
fax: 01293 440006
email: xla@airlinecrm.com
If you are unhappy about this reason given, contact the following:
AUC (Air Transport Users Council)
CAA House,
45/59 Kingsway,
London
WC2B 6TE
Provide them with the original flight number and ask them to confirm why Excel cancelled. I'd guess Excel will be required to furnish this body with the real reason.
Then seek legal advice as to how reasonable this is when judged against the clear wording in the EC261/2004 act and particulary as the responsibility lies with the air carrier to PROVE the reason was unavoidable.
IMO, a technical fault should be anticipated and spare aircraft or aircraft able to be "rented" at fairly short notice should be available. PLanes are complex machines prone to breaking down - that's why they are regularly serviced. Breakdowns should be expected.
IMO, crew out of hours is anticipatable - that's why they have rosters. The need to have more available crews is obvious and hardly unexpected.
Aircraft out of position, again, IMO, this becomes known when the aircraft fails to leave it's distant airport on it's journey towards the pick-up point. For example, a plane flying from Barbados to Gatwick fails to leave Barbados and is unlikely to do so for a number of hours. The flight time of, say 10 hours means this fact becomes known to Gatwick probably a minimum of 12 hours before that planes next departure. How much time does it take to obtain a replacement aircraft. If the answer is more than 12 hours then insufficient spare craft are available and providing more would overcome the problem - this problem is therefore forseeable.
It would be interesting to know what happened to the aircraft that was supposed to fly you originally. Did it later fly ? If so, where to and at what time did it take-off ? The AUC may be able to answer these questions because I'm sure Excel will not unless it's in court.
Push it Sarah - Ros Fernihough will advise 01922 621114.
Thanks, Stewart for the reminder.
Mike
Sorry Mike i think you are giving out the wrong impressions here.....Airlines should anticipate technical problems??...I think they`d all like to know how they do that...
Have Aircraft on standy by in case of the above....oh please have you any idea how much an hour it costs to have a serviceable aircraft parked on the ramp doing nothing? Sure all this could be provided but isnt because the travelling public would have to pay for it in much higher fares and the public have only an appetite for low fares!!
Getting an alternative aircraft from another company sometimes happens,as in this case,but often it just aint possible...
You get what you pay for in this life and airlines are part of it...
regards
Have Aircraft on standy by in case of the above....oh please have you any idea how much an hour it costs to have a serviceable aircraft parked on the ramp doing nothing? Sure all this could be provided but isnt because the travelling public would have to pay for it in much higher fares and the public have only an appetite for low fares!!
Getting an alternative aircraft from another company sometimes happens,as in this case,but often it just aint possible...
You get what you pay for in this life and airlines are part of it...
regards
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