Greece - Crete Discussion Forums

Discussions regarding holidays in Crete.
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On 17 November, we received a reply from Tina Sole of the Thomson After Travel team. I think I understood the reply, but I'm not completely convinced. Here are two actual quotes from Tina's letter:

"I appreciate that you are unhappy with the service it seems the booking branch supplied. As our travel shops are empowered to deal with their own complaints you will need to contact them should you feel the service to be incorrect."

"If you remain unhappy with the compensation offer from the after travel team as this is our final offer then we would have to leave you to take what ever action you deem appropriate."

It would appear that Ms Sole needs to take lessons in English Grammar and punctuation and Thomson needs to quality assure letters before they are sent out to customers. The letter, in our opinion, only needed to contain an ‘innit?' and a ‘Ya get me?' for it to be considered a complete grammatical disaster. Little wonder then that Thomson's After Travel Care is a complete and utter disgrace.

It also appears that there is an element of buck-passing in that the After Travel Team are blaming the branch for our holiday disaster. This doesn't look good for Thomson, to say the least.

I did contact the branch. They were a little disconcerted that the After Travel Team were blaming them for the issues that we experienced on our holiday. In spite of this, they offered us an additional £100 in compensation. The total compensation on offer is therefore £260 cash or £200 in travel vouchers.

This issue gets more and more bizarre.

Maybe, I should just take them to court and have done with it, although what a judge will think of this fiasco, heaven knows.

Stay tuned.
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We Brits, unlike most other Europeans, strangely expect our packaged holidays to be very cheap. The French, Dutch, Germans and Scandinavians pay far more for theirs and get better quality in return. I know people who spend weeks searching the internet for an extra £20-£30 discount most of which is squandered on booze in the first few days. The local hoteliers and villa owners get peanuts from the British tour operators which accounts for the fact that some of the most beautiful areas of Crete have been taken over by non-British tour operators, e.g Scandinavian in Western Crete. The British hordes are concentrated into places like Malia (or Kavos on Corfu) where the drunken antics can be ignored and, more to the point, a local profit can be made on alcohol! The reality is if we want quality we need to start paying for it. This will increase prices by c. 50%!
Best to book direct and take personal responsibility.
Happy holidays
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Richard

We chose Metochi cottage because is was described as peaceful and quite in Thomson's brochure. That's what we wanted, that's what we paid for and that's what we expected to get. We chose Kamilari in Crete because it is remote and off the beaten track. We had no intention of being surrounded by drunken Brits. That's why we chose the holiday. All we wanted was to relax following 5 failed IVF attempts and two miscarriages. I don't drink. My wife rarely drinks. All we wanted was to chill out for two weeks. All we got was a disaster of a Thomson holiday and a disaster of a Thomson complaints procedure. We would have paid whatever we needed to pay for a peaceful, quiet holiday. The holiday was grossly misrepresented in the Thomson brochure. We would have gladly paid 50% more for the holiday had the brochure description been accurate, but, it wasn't.

The fact remains, the holiday was misrepresented in the brochure.
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Hey Paul,
I wasn't getting at you...just the package system which in a sense is highlighted by your unfortunate experience. I just think that our packaged holiday industry is not really geared to the kind of holiday that you were seeking. They operate on a quantitative rather than a qualitative platform. You're absolutely right to chase them for misrepresentation. Good luck and keep us informed.
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Paul

I think you should take this to the small claims court.

I beleive you can get all the details on line of what to do. Really the holiday was totally missold. The toilet conditions and the swimming pool situation alone are not really 'fit for purpose' and the contact arrangements such as a phone being left with a rep who had left the company 6 months prior are inexcusable.

I wouldn't cash in or trade in anything that Thomson have sent you so far, as from what I read on the Complaints section that is deemed to show you have accepted what they are offering as full & fair compensation, dont return it, just hang on to it, and keep accurate records of all calls, emails, letters etc

It's irrelevant that you used a package tour company, argueably in times when small companys are going to the wind 19 to the dozen, it's the sensible approach.

What they sell should still be fit for purpose, despite what Richard is saying, yes they do offer low end products if that is what is required, but it isn't all they offer.

Calling something a cottage gives an image to anyone of what you would reasonably expect and accommodation stuck on the end of apartments to any reasonable person could not be deemed a cottage.

Good Luck. You may get further useful information if you put small claims court into the search engine whilst on the complaints forum. There have been a few success storys on here, I'm sure Mark who is a moderator took FC to court and won, plus other posters sometimes come back and update their threads.
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This clearly wasn't the holiday that you were hoping for and piled further stress on top of what you were already experiencing but I would suggest that you need to take specialist legal advice rather than pursuning this on your own through the Small Claims court because there are some very 'grey' areas that Thomson are bound to try and exploit.

1) In my experience with car hire in Crete (admittedly not that extensive) the standard CDW insurance doesn't cover damage to the tyres, exhaust and car undercarriage etc that might result if you take the car down some of the picturesque but atrocious tracks up in the hills. Is it possible that what the hire office offered you what additional cover for that in addition to the standard CDW insurance included in what you paid Thomson? You will need to go over all the small print in both what Thomson sent you re the car hire and the agreement you signed when picking up the car.

2) The photos of Metochi cottage on the Thomson website clearly show that the pool and outside sitting areas are very heavily shaded by large, dense trees and greeenery. When you booked the holiday through one of their branches, what pictures if any were you shown or are published in their brochure? I think that they will try and argue that you were shown these pictures and hence well aware that the pool and garden area was very heavily shaded. And might well argue that it is the presence of the trees etc that justify the description of it being 'secluded' as they don't seem to claim that it is isolated. I think that my garden is very secluded ie not visible from adjoining gardens and very private because of the way that I and my neighbours have our gardens planted up but it is isn't isolated - I do have near neighbours on both sides. I know that this sound like hairsplitting but that's what TOs do.

3) Sanitation systems in rural Crete are quite primitive at times and the layout of houses, especially conversions of older 'characterful' properties, do not reflect modern UK building regulations re what can and cannot open off different types of rooms. On the website they do make clear that the bathroom opens of the kitchen and that the kitchen is acessed via the bedroom. So once again they are likely to argue that you knew all about this before hand if you were shown the website when you booked.

4) The 'longdrop' loo is a more interesting point - 'longdrop' usually refers to what is probably more accurately described as a latrine. In other words there's no flushing mechanism and waste drops straight down into a very deep pit which is then topped uo with fresh earth to cover it. Eventually a new pit is dug and the latrine re-located. I've used these in the past in Alpine climbing huts - except the 'longdrop' was 100s of feet down the mountainside! But I can't imagine that was what you had - or was it? Even by Cretan standards that is pretty primitive and I've only used 'longdrops' in very remote areas in China, the Gambia and remoter rural Cuba. Or was it that it did have a flush into a cesspit or septic tank (common in villages in the hills which simply don't have any mains sewarage systme) but no U-bend in the loo to create a water trap? I have come across that on very rare ocassions - it is designed specifically to ensure that gases don't build up within a closed cess pit but I must admit that I've never seen this is use in Europe either because most cesspit and septic tank systems are vented in some in other way and the toilet itself functions just like any other standard one. Either way, make sure that in your dealings with Thomson that you are very accurate in the way you describe the sanitary arrangements - don't refer to it as a 'longdrop' if it wasn't as I describe because they are just going to say that it isn't a 'longdrop' because it was a plumbed in toilet connected to a cesspit or septic tank!

None of the above takes away from the fact that they didn't deal with your complaint appropriately while you were in resort despite you doing all you could to contact the rep and give them the opportunity to resolve the problem whilst you were still in resort.

SM
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I'll try and address the issues raised in the previous posts, for which I thank the contributors.

The bottom of the long drop loo was about 2 feet below floor level. It did have a flush but the water didn't have sufficient force to flush away the waste. You can guess the rest. Even copious amounts of bleach had little effect. There was no mention in the brochure that the toilet was a long drop.

I've been to Greece at least 20 times. I am well aware of the toilet facilities in Greece. However, the state of the toilet facilities at Metochi cottage are the worst that I have ever experienced.

The insurance that came with the car meant that we were liable for the first 700 Euro of damage, regardless of what part of the car was damaged. We were informed, when we booked the holiday, that the car came with 'Full Insurance'.

We didn't select the holiday from a brochure. We informed the Thomson branch staff of our requirements. We have been using the branch for the past 10 years. We know the staff well, they know us well. They suggested the holiday and brought out a brochure containing details of the holiday. The brochure was already opened at the appropriate page. The pool area was shown as being shaded in the brochure. However, this doesn't imply that the pool requires completely emptying and re-filling once a week and that this operation takes a minimum of two days per refill during which time the pool is unusable. Nor does it imply that the water is so cold that swimming in it for a period of more than a few minutes is impossible.

The sun deck, in the brochure, is shown as being devoid of trees apart from a couple of small ones. The sun deck now is completely in the shade.

A couple of weeks ago, we found out that the brochure given to us by the branch was the 2010 version. It was the 2010 version of the brochure that the branch used to sell the holiday. We were told that we couldn't take the brochure away with us because it was their shop copy and the only copy of the brochure that they had left. Further, the brochure was created by Simply Travel - a company that is now wholly owned by Thomson. This we were informed of by the branch staff. My guess is that the branch staff thought that the brochure was still current. Sadly, this is not the case.

It's interesting that the photos in the brochure don't show that the cottage is physically attached to a two-story holiday apartment block.

What Simply Travel/Thomson did in their brochure was to use a very carefully crafted description to turn the negative aspects of the cottage into what appears to be positive points. For example, they used the phrase 'rustic touches' so that when customers complained about the state of the toilet, they can then claim that it is one of the 'rustic touches' mentioned in the brochure. Technically, it may be legal. However, I can't see how it benefits them long-term. It's certainly not done them any good. Had we not had the experience of our last holiday, we would have continued booking with them for at least the next 20 years. Now, there's no way that we will use the company ever again.
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Stayed 1 week in Oct 2011.
Inside the cottage
"¢ Toilet
The flush water came through a spout and flowed into the hole - it did not clean the toilet bowl and we had to continually rinse it with water using a washing bowl to clean off the urine and loose faeces and to keep the smell under control. The flush itself was temperamental being an old cistern with a chain. The lower part of the toilet lid did hot stay up. In short it was completely unacceptable and I have to agree with the post on Tripadvisor that it should be condemned.
"¢ Shower
Not the prettiest sight - and no hook for the shower head so difficult to shower and with a short curtain water was always on the floor.
"¢ Kitchen
Electrics I'm sure don't meet health and safety standards
"¢ Heating
It was cold in the main living area and there was no heating and we had to sit in our outdoor wear in the evening for a couple of days until a heater was provided
"¢ Leak
It rained while we were there and there was leak in the living area roof and the water dripped onto the floor inside
"¢ Darkness
It was far too dark in the kitchen to see what you were doing to cook. And I couple of times I hit my head because I didn't see the dark wood encased extractor fan which overhung the worksurface by some margin.
At night we had to read in the living area or in bed using head torches!
Outside the cottage
"¢ Brochure misrepresentation
It states ‘It's all about romance and seclusion"¦'
o The main living area has a party wall with a 2 storey apartment block!
o The front door is two feet from the patio area of the 2 storey apartment block
o The building adjoining on the other side of the property is a business selling property and loans!
"¢ No sunlight
You could not spend any time enjoying the grounds of the cottage because the trees have been allowed to completely shade all areas including the patio. The picture of the patio in the brochure must be old because at no time during the day did it get sunlight. One of the main reasons for going to Crete is to enjoy sunshine - we had to go out every day to do this or sit in the road outside.
"¢ Furniture
There were only 2 chairs, both on the patio - I sat on one and fell through it because it was broken. It got replaced a couple of days later. The 2 sun beds had not been cleaned and were covered in tree fruit and debris (not that you would use them anyway as no sun could get through)
In summary it was disastrous and should not in Thomson's portfolio.

Have taken this long to post because went through the ritual of complaining to Thomsons but all they were concerned about was avoiding paying compensation so would not admit to the problems every letter being marked 'withou prejudice' and stating I was offered an alternative, though that was in a part of Crete I would never go to and was loads more money for me to pay.

Have photos of toilet, shower and kitchen if anyone wants it proven.


The area though is great.
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It sound like this cottage has got worse - which I thought was pretty impossible.

Thomson are a complete disgrace for keeping this cottage on the market.
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Stayed in Metochi Cottage in May 2011. Many of the problems outlined above were noticed by ourselves, in particular:

Cottage very dark internally
Lavatory problems, particularly with operating the flush - however the weather was not hot enough to register any smell
Garden overgrown with little sun penetrating

On the plus side:
Pool usable and warm
No noise problems with the apartments either side - although on one evening, the taverna 2 doors down was very noisy
Roof seating area and furniture serviceable and in the sun

We had a relaxing stay at Metochi, with no great problems - it was so quiet that I was able to share the garden on one evening with a stone marten, which came in for a nosey around. That said, we wouldn't choose to stay there again, but the basic nature of the accommodation was reflected in the price of the holiday. I wrote an review for Thomson on our return, which was not as negative as some of the comments on here, and was an honest reflection of our experiences. For what ever reason, the review has never been published on Thomson's web site. Perhaps that says it all.
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One view might be that if you subtract the cost of a return flight to Crete from the total cost of such a packaged holiday would the balance of funds get you good quality accommodation in the UK? Possibly not.
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If the brochure states that the cottage is secluded, then, that's what it has to be - secluded - not physically attached to the two story building next door (regardless of how quiet/noisy it is)!

If the brochure states that the cottage has a swimming pool, then it has to be serviceable, not so cold that you cannot swim in it and gets polluted every week from all of the leaves falling into it.

If a cottage has a toilet, then it shouldn't smell to high heaven in summer.

It's a question of brochure accuracy and fitness for purpose.

The cottage may be fit for purpose at certain times of the year - when it's cool and doesn't rain, but the brochure doesn't state that.

No matter what the cost, it has to be fit for purpose and must be represented accurately and THOMSON'S brochure grossly misrepresents this cottage.
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