Stated that David Walker had written all the Scottish law books this is incorrect. What I meant to say was that he had written all the books on the Law of Contracts.
I used this to get my free Hoover flights and also to get my shuttle fares paid from Scotland to Heathrow. A first and only. I had to look at the law of gift or gratituity,.

Hoover said if I bought their product they would give me a gift or gratuity and whilst my contract was with the shop I purchased it from this was a point of law.
The shuttle situation was that their wording on the offer was that you could fly from Glasgow Gatwick and Manchester. They could change the arrival destination. At the outset they could have said that certain destination are not available from certain Airports. This was therefore ambigous. A court of law would find in favour of the person as the company had the opportunity to build this into the offer.

They gave me flights from Heathrow and then I would have bought the flights from Scotland but my daughter was home for the weekend and told me this.
I tried to send a fax to them after telling me that I was giving them until 5pm Monday and they switched their fax off. I then sent a recorded letter to them and made the deadline 59m wednesday. They denied getting the letter but my husband worked for Post Office counter so could trace it and he also called them and said is your Fax on and sent it.
They then tried to get me to change dates and airports etc. I told them not to call me I would call them.
At 505pm I bought 2 shuttle tickets send then the bill to be paid in 14 days and I was told they would. I asked for it to be put into writind and I was proud to have the email that said they felt they were right but because of my determination and spirit they would pay it. At no time did I tell them what the point of law was. I just said you have had bad legal advice.
Following this and with a contact at Hoover my Mother in law and my sister in law also got their flights when I intervened on their behalf. For me it became a battle of wits and I enjoyed the battle. Was it worth it absolutely! If I had bought tickets from Edinburgh being my nearest airport then I would have failed. All the time I had to be a step ahead of them. Told me that they might be able to get me on a charter that would land at Heathrow and pick us up! Tried to book us from Edinburgh and then wanted my card to charge.
If you feel you are right and have the spirit to go ahead and fight then good luck to you and more power to your elbow!

Oh I have taken on so many things in my life I could write a book. been to Westminster to lobby my MP. etc etc etc.

Sue

The 60% relates to transportation costs, so your flight and transfer etc.

Is it me ? Or has this thread been sucked-into the belief that some kind of 60/40 or 40/60 or even 50/50 rule REALLY DOES APPLY.

I don't know the circumstances for the original complaint and compensation claim so I cannot be too specific. I can however tell you of a personal experience a couple of years back with regard to claiming.

Our group of 7 were delayed in our departure from Manchester to Sanford by just over 14 hours. We arrived at the hotel in Kissimmee at approx 8:00am in the morning rather than at approx. 7pm the evening before. We lost one complete night's accommodation.

Ros took on our case and it was setlled by the t.o. before reaching court. Ros based her case on a previous (precedence ?) established a couple of years ago in a case brought against Kuoni. The judge in that case agreed that the loss of one night's accomm. should result in a proportional reimbursement based upon the total number of nights booked, total taken and the ENTIRE package cost.

Ros recovered one fourteenth part of the entire package cost - no 60/40 splitting involved at all.

£50 per pax (£350 in all) was also added by way of compensation for distress etc.

Such a claim only holds if delayed outbound and if you booked a PACKAGE rather than flight only.

I'd avoid believing the 60/40 rule if other arguments can be applied with more success.

Mike, I started the thread. It's that fave tour op of mine , First Choice.

The claim I have is for a refund of the AI element of the holiday.
Total cost was £3640, the difference between AI & SC is £1400 give or take a few pence.

I got a refund in resort of hotel contract rate for 11 of the 14 days (took them 3 days to process it) which came to about £700 so i'm claiming for the other £700 - why should FC make a profit on it.

They wrote saying that ABTA guidelines say 60% of your hol is flights and 40% accom etc.

http://www.abta.com/download/heretohelp.pdf is the leaflet (page 12) that has this 'guideline' . As I can prove that the guideline does not fit the actual prices, i'm sure I have a case.
I've been in touch with Ros and just awaiting details from her.

I think that I have mentioned it before, but a 60/40 split, or whatever split if you like, is a total lot of rubbish.

Take Barbados for example.

Package holiday where we usually stay costs about £ 1400 - so by their reasoning £ 840 would be for flights. A little too much as they cost £ 500 max.

Then again, I could stay at the Sandy Lane where the same holiday would cost £ 9,800. So how could the price for the flights suddenly change to £ 5,880
A better guidance for compensation might be looking at the price per night a hotel charges and take it from there.

Mark

I think you need to consider the word they use - Guideline!

It is obvious that in the case of a cheap holiday then 60/40 split will be nearer than one costing say £1,000.

Each case will be different depending what you pay. I would consider 60/40 as a starting point. If it was a cheap last minute thing then perhaps you cannot complain that it turns out even cheaper.

With the rise of DIY then the actual charges for each portion can more easily be identified. When a TO is selling a holiday at £1,000 and also selling return flights on the same aircraft at £200 then the 60/40 split begins to look silly.

fwh

Totally agree with Mark, In my case I have provided a breakdown of the 3 alternatives for the same holiday same weeks but broke it down to

Flight Only
Self Catering
All Inclusive

I've just priced up a hol,
2 Weeks AI - £4069.12
Same 2 weeks, same flights but self catering £2679.84
So that makes the AI element of the holiday £1389.28

If you apply the guidline to the AI price of £4069.12 the flights are supposedly £2441.47 leaving £1627.64 for Accom & AI so that means the hotel must only cost £238.19 !
This is where their argument starts to break down.

When you then price up the flights (same ones as in the package), these come out at £1590 which is £851.47 cheaper than the guideline dictates.

Remember,

You also have to take into consideration airport transfers to and from your accommodation, which are all apportioned into the 60/40 split.

Best wishes
edit
unauthorised signature removed

I have taken that into account,

2 Weeks AI 4069.12

2 Weeks SC 2679.84

60% of £4069.12 2441.47

40% of £4069.12 1627.65

Actual Flights 1590

Difference between actual Flight Cost & 60% abta guide = 851.47

Difference between AI & SC 1389.28

So by using Abta 'guideline', accom & AI element = £1627.65

The difference between AI & SC is £1389.28 so take that away from the £1627.65 leaves you with £238.37 for 14 nights in the hotel or £17 night.

Again using the abta 60% guideline for flights & transfers, £2441.47 - actual price of flights £1590 = £851.47 for the 2 coach journeys !

In this case the flights actually cost about 39.07% of the total cost of the holiday. If you add on £200 for coach transfers (very generous) the split is still only at 44% for flights & transfers !

Here are some I posted earlier on this thread -

I would also have a word with Ros Fernihough and/or my local Trading Standards.

In short I wouldn't accept anything a travel agent or travel company told me about compensation calculations.

Why on earth would anyone want to endure flights and transfers for the purpose of having a lousy holiday?

Compensation, I've forgotten compensation for the loss of your valuable time off work, disappointment, and the work involved in pursuing your claim against them.

This is why you need professional advice.

ABTA is a sort of 'trade union' for the travel industry more likely to look after their interests than yours.

Peter

I've had the forms through today from Ros's firm. There was also a note included saying that Ros is going into hospital from weds 18th july for a knee op and the travel dept will be closed between 18th july and 4th august as Mrs Shea will also be on leave for this period.

Existing cases will still be worked on as Ros will be having files delivered to hospital and home but new cases won't be worked until 4th August.

I left it till after the school holidays to send the detail off to Ros, she's now taken the case on a no-win no-fee basis.

Watch this space......

Good luck with it. Please let us know how you get on.

Sarah

Just a quick update, Ros & Pam took on the case and wrote to FC 27/9 and they've just wrote to me to advise that FC have failed to respond to their letter.
Needless to say a chaser letter pointing out their breach of Abta code of conduct has been sent by Ros / Pam.

What are FC thinking of ?

Well we've just had another letter from Ros informing us that FC have failed to respond to any of Ros's letters in the last 3 months leaving us with only one option now and that is to take them to court.

Thanks for the update and good luck with taking them to court.

luci