I am looking for advice as to whether I can claim compensation for false information given by Virgin Holidays"¦
In March 05 I booked a family holiday to Florida. The holiday was fully paid up at the end of May but 10 days before departure (22nd August 05) we still had not received the tickets. I phoned Virgin and was on hold for one hour before giving up. I tried again - this time remaining on hold for one and a half hours at which point I gave up and emailed them.
The following week, with four working days left, the tickets arrived and were put safely away. On Sunday 21st Aug we were going to check in 24 hours early so packed everything up and waited for the time to leave. While waiting I sat and read through the booklet Virgin had sent with the tickets. I then stumbled upon a paragraph stating that passports needed to be valid for 90 days after the date of departure - I thought everything was OK but checked only to find that my two kids' passports only had 75 days remaining.
I thought it would not be a problem but called Virgin to check. After I explained the issue I was told that without exception we could not travel and that we had to cancel the holiday - in fact I was asked quite eagerly if I wished to process the cancellation immediately.
It felt like a sledgehammer had hit me in the back of the head but I continued to argue with them that they could not cancel and that they had to give me some options. This carried on for about one hour and while my wife was calling embassies and other flight operators for later flights I was getting no where. In the end the now obviously overseas customer services lady explained that she knew nothing about the holiday industry and passports and could only read what she had in front of her but that she would find someone who did know something and get them to call me back.
I waited about 20 minutes and someone did call me back but they only had the same answer - I had to cancel. I argued for about 30 minutes longer but then my call was escalated to a man who calmly asked why I had not asked to re-schedule my holiday! I accepted his offer to re-schedule the holiday for two days later so we could get new passports for the kids. They charged me over £500 but at that time I was happy even though they advised that I could not reschedule the hotel so we had to loose two days.
We then went off to London and got the two passports. During the wait we did some investigating and soon found out that what Virgin had advised was not completely correct - they stated (in the booklet and verbally) that "If travelling under the Visa Waiver Program, the passport must be valid for at least 90 days from the date on which the holder enters the United States. If not, the holder will be admitted until the expiration date on the passport". Now we were not very happy.
On the Wednesday we arrived at the airport very early just in case there were any further problems. There were not and we checked in. As there was no one else around I took the opportunity - after checking in - to complain to one of the Virgin managers at the airport. I was told that there was nothing that could be done and that "they' just do that for insurance purposes" i.e. it reduces the company's insurance (which would cover the cost of returning anyone rejected entry to a country) if they applied only part or the rule and the rule would not apply to two kids going to Florida on a package holiday with their parents with passports only valid for 75 days.
We then had our holiday which went without problem - other than finding out that the Hard Rock Hotel had automatically re-scheduled our stay when they saw we were arriving late - we need not have lost the two days.
On our return I wrote a letter of complaint and posted it off. I did not realise at the time that if you did not send letters by registered post then they would automatically be lost. With that letter lost I resent it again 3 weeks later by registered post and received a standard 'thank you for your letter...' response. Within 28 days I received an apology from Virgin and an offer of compensation. However, on reading it again I noticed that they had opened the letter with reference to my "forthcoming holiday" and they had only offered £25 per person compensation - a total of £100.
I wrote back the same day (registered post) advising that I would not accept the compensation and that they should re examine my complaint. The next day I received a revised invoice for the holiday showing the total cost, total paid and a refund of £75 (3 x £25) - they couldn't even get that right.
I then received the 'thank you for your letter' response and waited 28 days but received nothing back. I was then advised to wait a further 28 days which I did and then wrote again - this time with no response.
It has now been almost 70 days since I heard anything from them. I find their behaviour from start to finish has been very, very poor. If they wish to apply only part of an immigration rule then fine - but they should advise this right from the first communication and repeat it on any further communication. I find the fact that they ignore any communication they wish to be unprofessional to the extreme.
I know I can now report them to ABTA but I would rather take legal action if that is possible"¦
Legal action?! ABTA?! No offence, but this is hardly something that anyone will take seriously.
Virgin advise pax of this requirement, in order to completely cover yes themselves, but also their passengers form getting stuck out there and no way of getting home. What would you have done if you had got out to the US and one of your kids pasports expired a few days before you were due back home? Lets think. You would contact your Virgin Rep, have a go, demand a new passport, etc etc.
Advice on any immigration issue is there to cover you and to cover them. If you dont heed it, its not their fault.
Just for the record, they also cover this issue in their brochures, in the "Very important, not so small print", which is also available on their website. So it is available to you, right from the very start of the booking proccess. You accept this advice and also the Booking Conditions when you enter in to your holiday contract with them.
So no, dont expect any kind of compensation.
Virgin advise pax of this requirement, in order to completely cover yes themselves, but also their passengers form getting stuck out there and no way of getting home. What would you have done if you had got out to the US and one of your kids pasports expired a few days before you were due back home? Lets think. You would contact your Virgin Rep, have a go, demand a new passport, etc etc.
Advice on any immigration issue is there to cover you and to cover them. If you dont heed it, its not their fault.
Just for the record, they also cover this issue in their brochures, in the "Very important, not so small print", which is also available on their website. So it is available to you, right from the very start of the booking proccess. You accept this advice and also the Booking Conditions when you enter in to your holiday contract with them.
So no, dont expect any kind of compensation.
I've always been advised about passport expiry when I've booked a package holiday. It's in the ABTA code of conduct that this question must be asked.
I think it's 90 days in the USA as you are allowed to stay for up to 90 days.
I think it's 90 days in the USA as you are allowed to stay for up to 90 days.
Our local Thomas Cook ask and they also give you a Health & Visa print out if you book any holidays with them.
Kath HT Admin
Kath HT Admin
The Virgin brochure and web site has a whole host of information on passport requirements. It also supplies website addresses for both the British Passport Office and US Embassy.
A section within the booking conditions also states clearly that "all passport, visa, travel insurance and health certificate requirements are your responsibility and Virgin Holidays accepts no responsibility for any delay or expenses incurred through any irregularity in your documentation". I think all tour operators have similar in their brochures as although I have just dug out the Virgin brochure to get this information I can recall similar with Thomson and First Choice in the past.
Virgin have also add a comment in RED in the brochure saying " know what? if you turn up for your flight with an invalid passport or no visa when you need one we will be very sympathetic but.. YOU CAN NOT BOARD YOUR FLIGHT"
Whilst I feel sorry for the troubled start to your holiday, especially with kids in tow, - surely the checking of passport information should have been done prior to, or at least shortly after booking your holiday, rather than picking this up when your travel doucuments arrived (albiet late it seems) just before you are due to depart.
I'm surprised Virgin have paid anything out at all. I think this is one to chalk up to experience and although an expensive mistake, probably one you won't make again.
A section within the booking conditions also states clearly that "all passport, visa, travel insurance and health certificate requirements are your responsibility and Virgin Holidays accepts no responsibility for any delay or expenses incurred through any irregularity in your documentation". I think all tour operators have similar in their brochures as although I have just dug out the Virgin brochure to get this information I can recall similar with Thomson and First Choice in the past.
Virgin have also add a comment in RED in the brochure saying " know what? if you turn up for your flight with an invalid passport or no visa when you need one we will be very sympathetic but.. YOU CAN NOT BOARD YOUR FLIGHT"
Whilst I feel sorry for the troubled start to your holiday, especially with kids in tow, - surely the checking of passport information should have been done prior to, or at least shortly after booking your holiday, rather than picking this up when your travel doucuments arrived (albiet late it seems) just before you are due to depart.
I'm surprised Virgin have paid anything out at all. I think this is one to chalk up to experience and although an expensive mistake, probably one you won't make again.
It really does pay to read the 'small print' especially when travelling outside Europe. Bear in mind that the USA is concerned about security and when they say you can't travel they mean it.
As previously said I think you will have to chalk this up to experience and be extra careful in future.
Pippa
As previously said I think you will have to chalk this up to experience and be extra careful in future.
Pippa
Nick ... I seem to be reading this situation differently from others. If Virgin Holidays are clearly stating this minimum 90 day passport validity as part of their own specific booking conditions, then you may well have no case against them, as has been suggested in previous replies.
But if they are suggesting that the 90 day passport validity requirement forms part of US Immigration rules, then that is a different matter, and certainly not an opinion which I would agree with.
I don't have the Virgin Holidays brochure or the booklet which is supplied with tickets. But looking at the Virgin Holidays website, there is a section under the heading of "Documents required for entry to the USA (Latest Travel Update)" where it states:
Nowhere in that section do I see any reference to a minimum 90 day validity requirement. However, if you were in any doubt, you could follow Virgin advice and check with the US Embassy. On their website, you would find this:
If you then wanted a second opinion, you could look at the Foreign & Commonwealth Office website, and you would find this:
And so although Virgin Holidays may say that
I personally am not seeing any passport irregularities as far as the US Embassy, the Foreign Office or the Passport Agency are concerned. If Virgin Holidays have this passport validity requirement as one of their own specific booking conditions, rather than a US Immigration requirement, then it does not appear to be clearly stated in the "Documents required for entry to the USA" section of their website which you might have been expected to consult during some part of the booking process.
If you feel that Virgin have misinterpreted US Immigration requirements, as opposed to you misinterpreting their booking conditions, then it may be worth having a word with Ros Fernihough, a solicitor specialising in travel law. Ros can be contacted on 01922 621114.
David
But if they are suggesting that the 90 day passport validity requirement forms part of US Immigration rules, then that is a different matter, and certainly not an opinion which I would agree with.
I don't have the Virgin Holidays brochure or the booklet which is supplied with tickets. But looking at the Virgin Holidays website, there is a section under the heading of "Documents required for entry to the USA (Latest Travel Update)" where it states:
REMEMBER YOUR PASSPORTS...AND DON'T FORGET YOUR VISAS!
You MUST have a FULL and VALID passport to visit the USA, and you should check with the Embassy for current requirements.
Nowhere in that section do I see any reference to a minimum 90 day validity requirement. However, if you were in any doubt, you could follow Virgin advice and check with the US Embassy. On their website, you would find this:
Does my British passport have to be valid for six months beyond my date of departure from the United States?
No, if your passport is not valid for at least six months beyond your date of departure from the United States, it will not affect your eligibility to travel. The United States has an agreement with the United Kingdom automatically extending the validity of a passport for six months past the passport's expiration date. Therefore, your passport need remain valid only for the duration of your stay in the United States.
If you are traveling visa free under the Visa Waiver Program and your passport is not valid for 90 days, you will be admitted into the United States until the date on which the passport expires.
If you then wanted a second opinion, you could look at the Foreign & Commonwealth Office website, and you would find this:
UK Passports
You are advised to check the remaining validity of your passport as soon as you plan to travel to the US. Although the US and the UK have an agreement that allows people travelling from one country to the other to enter with a passport that only has six months validity or less, you should nevertheless try to renew your passport beforehand. This is in case your departure from the US is delayed for any reason; if you wish to make side visits to other countries; or if you have further travel plans immediately after your visit to the US.
And so although Virgin Holidays may say that
"all passport, visa, travel insurance and health certificate requirements are your responsibility and Virgin Holidays accepts no responsibility for any delay or expenses incurred through any irregularity in your documentation".
I personally am not seeing any passport irregularities as far as the US Embassy, the Foreign Office or the Passport Agency are concerned. If Virgin Holidays have this passport validity requirement as one of their own specific booking conditions, rather than a US Immigration requirement, then it does not appear to be clearly stated in the "Documents required for entry to the USA" section of their website which you might have been expected to consult during some part of the booking process.
If you feel that Virgin have misinterpreted US Immigration requirements, as opposed to you misinterpreting their booking conditions, then it may be worth having a word with Ros Fernihough, a solicitor specialising in travel law. Ros can be contacted on 01922 621114.
David
David,
I'm impressed by your logically presented argument. I'm in agreement with you on this one.
However, I accept that Virgin are permitted to introduce conditions into their contracts (providing they are reasonable) but these must be clearly stated to the customer at the time of booking and as Virgin's conditions differ from those set by the U.S. Immigration Dept. I believe Virgin have a responsibility to make this aspect VERY clear at the time of booking.
They should again reiterate their variation of the U.S. Immigration rules when sending the booking confirmation - and do so in writing. I believe it the responsibility of the Travel Agent and/or Tour Operator to inform the traveller about visa and health issues relevant to their travel.
Ring Ros as David suggests.
Keep their letters offering compensation - it may help your case in as much as they have admitted some form of liability.
Mike
I'm impressed by your logically presented argument. I'm in agreement with you on this one.
However, I accept that Virgin are permitted to introduce conditions into their contracts (providing they are reasonable) but these must be clearly stated to the customer at the time of booking and as Virgin's conditions differ from those set by the U.S. Immigration Dept. I believe Virgin have a responsibility to make this aspect VERY clear at the time of booking.
They should again reiterate their variation of the U.S. Immigration rules when sending the booking confirmation - and do so in writing. I believe it the responsibility of the Travel Agent and/or Tour Operator to inform the traveller about visa and health issues relevant to their travel.
Ring Ros as David suggests.
Keep their letters offering compensation - it may help your case in as much as they have admitted some form of liability.
Mike
If you were travelling using the visa waiver system, passports need to be valid for 90 days beyond the date of entry to the USA.
This is the responsibility of the passenger not the carrier, indeed as the carrier, Virgin can, and usually are fined up to £2000 by the Immigration department of the country concerned if they carry passengers with incorrect documentation. The USA is unfortunately a different kettle of fish to say Spain who also require 90 days, but often when you enter Spain hardly glance at your passport.
It is the responsibility of the travel agent or tour operator to inform the passengers of these requirements, but the passengers responsibility to ensure they are fulfilled.
I am afraid that you will probably have to put this down to experience and
even though Virgin have paid you some compensation, thay are not bound to do so and I would think are offering you this as a goodwill gesture rather than any admission of guilt.
This is the responsibility of the passenger not the carrier, indeed as the carrier, Virgin can, and usually are fined up to £2000 by the Immigration department of the country concerned if they carry passengers with incorrect documentation. The USA is unfortunately a different kettle of fish to say Spain who also require 90 days, but often when you enter Spain hardly glance at your passport.
It is the responsibility of the travel agent or tour operator to inform the passengers of these requirements, but the passengers responsibility to ensure they are fulfilled.
I am afraid that you will probably have to put this down to experience and
even though Virgin have paid you some compensation, thay are not bound to do so and I would think are offering you this as a goodwill gesture rather than any admission of guilt.
Hi peatka ...
Regarding your comment:
What the US Embassy actually say is:
With regard to your comparison with Spain:
This is often a source of conflicting information from the travel industry. However, contrary to what is specified in some tour operators' brochures, there is no minimum 90 day or 6 month passport validity requirement for entry to Spain. Passports need only be valid for the intended duration of stay in the country, a fact which has previously been confirmed for Holidaytruths by both the Spanish Embassy and the Foreign Office.
David
Regarding your comment:
If you were travelling using the visa waiver system, passports need to be valid for 90 days beyond the date of entry to the USA.
What the US Embassy actually say is:
If you are traveling visa free under the Visa Waiver Program and your passport is not valid for 90 days, you will be admitted into the United States until the date on which the passport expires.
With regard to your comparison with Spain:
The USA is unfortunately a different kettle of fish to say Spain who also require 90 days, but often when you enter Spain hardly glance at your passport.
This is often a source of conflicting information from the travel industry. However, contrary to what is specified in some tour operators' brochures, there is no minimum 90 day or 6 month passport validity requirement for entry to Spain. Passports need only be valid for the intended duration of stay in the country, a fact which has previously been confirmed for Holidaytruths by both the Spanish Embassy and the Foreign Office.
David
I think most TO's specify 90 days validity after expiry of your planned holiday finish just in case you were to be unfortunate enough to have to extend your stay because of ill health.
Mark
Mark
David
according to the Columbus travel guide which our company employs, the
minimum validity for the USA is 90 days if using the visa waiver system.
Spain is also listed as 90 days unless you hold a valid id card for your country of residence for example a German person could travel on a
passport with 2 days validity but must show their id card as supporting documentation.
Some countries ask for 6 months validity ie Turkey, for UK holders but not for ID card holders.
Portugal only requires validity during the stay, ie if your passport runs out
the day after you leave Portugal, that is acceptable.
To reconfirm what I stated earlier, as a travel agent, we can advise the clients what the requirements are using the facilities to hand, but the responsibility to ensure these are fulfilled lies with the passenger.
I have worked for a scheduled airline in the past and they are very keen on ensuring that these requiremments are adhered to as they are usually fined if they carry passengers with incorrect documentation. This also goes for the charter carriers.
It goes without saying that had the original writer of this post been one of our clients, we would have advised 6 months validity at the time of booking, and he would then have been able to ensure his documents were in order and travel on his original holiday without any bother.
We normally advise 6 months for all destinations to err on the side of caution rather than to risk the clients travel arrangements.
according to the Columbus travel guide which our company employs, the
minimum validity for the USA is 90 days if using the visa waiver system.
Spain is also listed as 90 days unless you hold a valid id card for your country of residence for example a German person could travel on a
passport with 2 days validity but must show their id card as supporting documentation.
Some countries ask for 6 months validity ie Turkey, for UK holders but not for ID card holders.
Portugal only requires validity during the stay, ie if your passport runs out
the day after you leave Portugal, that is acceptable.
To reconfirm what I stated earlier, as a travel agent, we can advise the clients what the requirements are using the facilities to hand, but the responsibility to ensure these are fulfilled lies with the passenger.
I have worked for a scheduled airline in the past and they are very keen on ensuring that these requiremments are adhered to as they are usually fined if they carry passengers with incorrect documentation. This also goes for the charter carriers.
It goes without saying that had the original writer of this post been one of our clients, we would have advised 6 months validity at the time of booking, and he would then have been able to ensure his documents were in order and travel on his original holiday without any bother.
We normally advise 6 months for all destinations to err on the side of caution rather than to risk the clients travel arrangements.
Thanks for that peatka. The often complicated and varying passport requirements worldwide mean that some of the travel industry and major travel guides prefer to err on the side of caution, and advise of a minimum 90 day or 6 month minimum passport validity requirement for most countries, even where no such requirement exists.
However it is one thing to err on the side of caution by giving advice, and another to completely disrupt someone's holiday plans by suggesting that this cautious advice is in fact a legal entry requirement for the country concerned.
There may be some sound and very logical reasons for giving such advice, but I feel that they should clarify - to staff as well as customers - that it is advice and not necessarily a legal requirement. In cases where customers discover at the last minute that documentation may not comply with the advice given, then the agent, operator or airline should be able to check whether that advice matches the legal entry requirement for the country concerned, before denying someone permission to travel.
We are drifting away here from the original topic regarding US entry requirements. But with regard to Spain, I have known of several cases where families have been warned by agents only after booking, that their holiday is unlikely to proceed because they do not have a minimum of 6 months validity remaining on their passport, with little or no time to apply for a new one. A simple check with the Spanish Embassy would confirm that there is no such requirement and that as long as the passport is valid for the duration of the holiday, there is absolutely no problem. With advances in technology, I would like to think that the industry could be much more capable of accessing the official legal entry requirements when necessary, rather than offer 'a one answer fits all' form of advice, and then sticking rigidly to that advice even in cases where it clearly conflicts with the actual legal entry requirement.
David
However it is one thing to err on the side of caution by giving advice, and another to completely disrupt someone's holiday plans by suggesting that this cautious advice is in fact a legal entry requirement for the country concerned.
There may be some sound and very logical reasons for giving such advice, but I feel that they should clarify - to staff as well as customers - that it is advice and not necessarily a legal requirement. In cases where customers discover at the last minute that documentation may not comply with the advice given, then the agent, operator or airline should be able to check whether that advice matches the legal entry requirement for the country concerned, before denying someone permission to travel.
We are drifting away here from the original topic regarding US entry requirements. But with regard to Spain, I have known of several cases where families have been warned by agents only after booking, that their holiday is unlikely to proceed because they do not have a minimum of 6 months validity remaining on their passport, with little or no time to apply for a new one. A simple check with the Spanish Embassy would confirm that there is no such requirement and that as long as the passport is valid for the duration of the holiday, there is absolutely no problem. With advances in technology, I would like to think that the industry could be much more capable of accessing the official legal entry requirements when necessary, rather than offer 'a one answer fits all' form of advice, and then sticking rigidly to that advice even in cases where it clearly conflicts with the actual legal entry requirement.
David
David,
I have checked all the systems we have access to ( Columbus,DG&G )
and also one that is linked to through the embassy site (expedia).Only the DG&G states that travellers will be admitted to U.S with less than 90 days validity, however that would not stop us erring on the side of caution and advising clients differently. Our current policy is that 6 months minimum is required and a visa waiver explanation form showing the requirements is signed by the client and a copy given to them for further reference. Regardless of whatever it shows if you ensure you have that
validity you will not have a problem going anywhere. If you renew your
passport inside 6 months of expiry, the passport office will back date the current validity anyway.
Just returning though to Spain all 3 systems I have checked show 90 days validity. We will still be advising clients to follow these rules and not to accept the suggestion that any validity will do. Whilst we may be seen to be overcautious, we want our clients to have trouble free travel and although the final decision rests with the client (we can only advise) as has been shown on these pages we cannot afford to get into a "you never told us" situation.
I have checked all the systems we have access to ( Columbus,DG&G )
and also one that is linked to through the embassy site (expedia).Only the DG&G states that travellers will be admitted to U.S with less than 90 days validity, however that would not stop us erring on the side of caution and advising clients differently. Our current policy is that 6 months minimum is required and a visa waiver explanation form showing the requirements is signed by the client and a copy given to them for further reference. Regardless of whatever it shows if you ensure you have that
validity you will not have a problem going anywhere. If you renew your
passport inside 6 months of expiry, the passport office will back date the current validity anyway.
Just returning though to Spain all 3 systems I have checked show 90 days validity. We will still be advising clients to follow these rules and not to accept the suggestion that any validity will do. Whilst we may be seen to be overcautious, we want our clients to have trouble free travel and although the final decision rests with the client (we can only advise) as has been shown on these pages we cannot afford to get into a "you never told us" situation.
I can see both sides of the argument (Peakta and David's) - and perhaps I could suggest the following;
At the outset the t.a. should inform the client of the 'safe' rules with respect to 90 days or 6 months - depending upon country being visited and taking into account the US visa waiver facility.
Then, when a problem arises whereby the passenger MAY have a potential problem with documentation the carrier/airline permits the passenger(s) to travel only upon receipt of a signed waiver and credit card guarantee that should the country refuse entry and subsequently charge a repatriation fee/fine the passenger pays those costs.
This puts the responsibility on the travellers shoulders - as it right and proper - and protects the carrier from financial loss. It also allows the passenger to check the specific rules with the country concerned and fly if they have been assured there'll be no problem.
The carrier, choosing to preempt a possible problem with immigration by refusing carriage is, I believe, overstepping the line. A form of insurance could be arranged, I'm sure, to cover this situation with the passenger having to pay the premium before travel is permitted.
I wonder how the airlines handle the requirement that a USA bound passenger needs a defined first night's accommodation complete with address and telephone number. How could an airline verify, for example, Aunty Mable's address as valid should a passenger provide such?
Mike
At the outset the t.a. should inform the client of the 'safe' rules with respect to 90 days or 6 months - depending upon country being visited and taking into account the US visa waiver facility.
Then, when a problem arises whereby the passenger MAY have a potential problem with documentation the carrier/airline permits the passenger(s) to travel only upon receipt of a signed waiver and credit card guarantee that should the country refuse entry and subsequently charge a repatriation fee/fine the passenger pays those costs.
This puts the responsibility on the travellers shoulders - as it right and proper - and protects the carrier from financial loss. It also allows the passenger to check the specific rules with the country concerned and fly if they have been assured there'll be no problem.
The carrier, choosing to preempt a possible problem with immigration by refusing carriage is, I believe, overstepping the line. A form of insurance could be arranged, I'm sure, to cover this situation with the passenger having to pay the premium before travel is permitted.
I wonder how the airlines handle the requirement that a USA bound passenger needs a defined first night's accommodation complete with address and telephone number. How could an airline verify, for example, Aunty Mable's address as valid should a passenger provide such?
Mike
Mike,
nice idea, too much faffing around. The immigration service never blame the passenger, they always blame the carrier for not checking. Part of the
fine is also to repatriate the passenger immediately and at the airlines expense, so airlines get big bills , passenger gets free flight home.
Besides, as I have all ready said, the onus IS on the passenger, not the carrier, agent or tour operator. We will advise, the client must make the final decision on their own. If they choose incorrectly, why should the carrier cover the cost. This is why we tell clients 6 months validity, it may be different for different destinations, but 6 months covers all with leeway for mistakes.
Lets just agree that passport validity is a minefield. ensure you've always got 6 months validity, you can't go wrong.
peakta.
nice idea, too much faffing around. The immigration service never blame the passenger, they always blame the carrier for not checking. Part of the
fine is also to repatriate the passenger immediately and at the airlines expense, so airlines get big bills , passenger gets free flight home.
Besides, as I have all ready said, the onus IS on the passenger, not the carrier, agent or tour operator. We will advise, the client must make the final decision on their own. If they choose incorrectly, why should the carrier cover the cost. This is why we tell clients 6 months validity, it may be different for different destinations, but 6 months covers all with leeway for mistakes.
Lets just agree that passport validity is a minefield. ensure you've always got 6 months validity, you can't go wrong.
peakta.
We went with Virgin to Flordia last december. I renewed my daughters passport because it did not have 6 months on it after we returned only 5. I know Virgin state 90 days but i was not takingt any chances as i thought it was 6 months. I phoned the passport office who informed me that as USA could change the conditions at any time they advised me to renew it.
Also Virgin sent the tickets through with a spelling mistake on our surname. They insisted this was ok as they were allowed up to 2 spelling errors. Yet again i was not going to take the risk and made them issue new tickets.
Also Virgin sent the tickets through with a spelling mistake on our surname. They insisted this was ok as they were allowed up to 2 spelling errors. Yet again i was not going to take the risk and made them issue new tickets.
Last December I booked last minute with United Airlines to fly to New York on a short trip. 2 days before departure I realised my passport ran out in February. I found an internet site that said the validity for USA was 90 days so figured I would be OK. We checked in at Heathrow with no problems and then went thru to departures. Then I did the maths. I actually had only 71 days left on my passport. We went to board the aircraft where there was another passport check and I was sure that this time I would be refused and told I could not go. But no - all was well. So the next place for entry refusal would be immigration at JFK. Again, not a word was said. I know from previous experience that Virgin are sticklers for this rule but maybe I was OK because United are an American airline? I must admit that I feel that my passport is a valid travel document right up to the day of expiry and, in view of the cost, I should be allowed to travel right up to this expiry date. Someone is trying to make more money out of us travellers?
Thanks everyone...
David and Mike were the first to pick up on what my complaint was about i.e. Virgin had not advised that 'their' rules were different to that of the US Embassy and the fact that the tickets only arrived 4 days before travel meant that I would have had no time to fix the problem. Plus note that they apply strictly the 90 day rule to keep their insurance costs down.
When I sent in the original posting of this topic I also wrote to Virgin giving them one week to respond to my previous letters. It was the non-closure of the matter that was really winding me up as we had a fantastic holiday in the end (I would thoroughy recommend staying at the Hard Rock Hotel) and are now looking forward to our next one. This morning they responded and enclosed cheque covering the cost of the lost two days, £25 to cover the cost of phone calls and postage and some compensation. It is not as much I had originally planned on getting back but it is enough to cover a holday deposit and it is closure.
Thanks and I think this thread will act as a very good knowledge base on the subject...
Nick
David and Mike were the first to pick up on what my complaint was about i.e. Virgin had not advised that 'their' rules were different to that of the US Embassy and the fact that the tickets only arrived 4 days before travel meant that I would have had no time to fix the problem. Plus note that they apply strictly the 90 day rule to keep their insurance costs down.
When I sent in the original posting of this topic I also wrote to Virgin giving them one week to respond to my previous letters. It was the non-closure of the matter that was really winding me up as we had a fantastic holiday in the end (I would thoroughy recommend staying at the Hard Rock Hotel) and are now looking forward to our next one. This morning they responded and enclosed cheque covering the cost of the lost two days, £25 to cover the cost of phone calls and postage and some compensation. It is not as much I had originally planned on getting back but it is enough to cover a holday deposit and it is closure.
Thanks and I think this thread will act as a very good knowledge base on the subject...
Nick
Glad to hear you eventually got sorted Nick. 
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