can you tell me if the same rule applies to ATOL as we have booked with an agent who is a member of ATOL.

ATOL is air travel organisers license's. It protects your money or stops you being stranded abroad if your tour op goes bust.

Please be aware scheduled flights are not protected including the budget airlines, Ryan Air, Air Berlin, Easyjet these are scheduled flights as well. The only way a scheduled airfare is covered by ATOL if you buy a ticket through a agent but don't get a ticket striaght away. Scheduled airfares are not covered by ATOL if get the ticket striaght away or if you buy the ticket direct from the airline.

The other problem that arises is dynamic packages where a company is acting as agent for airlines and hotels. If you travel on a charter flight that will protect you against being stranded abroad but not if your hotel goes bust or has to shut for some reason. The other thing with a dynamic package its not a package holiday covered by the package holiday regulations. They are not selling you a package but just booking different parts of your holiday with different suppliers for you.

Booking a DIY holiday on the internet is not covered by ATOL where you book a flight on line and then book a hotel. Many people think DIY holidays are cheaper until something goes wrong and are stranded abroad having to get themselves home at extra expense. The cheapest may not always be the cheapest in the long run.

Here is a link with ATOL Q&A

http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=1080&pagetype=70

Could I ask how you would know if you are booking a dynamic package?

A dynamic package is supplied by somebody booking a you a flight from one agent and hotel from another agent on your behalf. They don't hold a ATOL so cannot sell a air package holiday themselves but only on behalf of a tour operator who has a ATOL. People who do dynamic packages often put together stage and hen nights for a weekend and will put together full holidays. Where people think they are covered by ATOL is because the company will show the ATOL sign whereas they will sell a holiday for a tour op who is a ATOL holder. Many of the internet booking companies sell holidays that are not ATOL because they have just acted as a agent for the customer between to suppliers.

Its all very confusing and the only way to know is ask the agent if they hold a ATOL and for the number. You can then check out their ATOL licence with the CAA. You can also ask them is the holiday covered by ATOL and the package holiday regulations. Any paper work you get should have ATOL on it. There are eceptions to the rules where a ticket isn't issued straight away or where a chartered flight is booked. It will mean you won't get stranded abroad but most of these dynamic packages the flight is booked for you direct with easyjet, ect.

If you look at the link it explains it more. All of this was part of my guild of business travel course and exams.

Thanks for that. We have booked with an independent travel agent for the first time so I was a bit worried for a minute but they have an ATOL number and this checks out on the ATOL web page so we are OK.

thanks for the info, if you ask me its all very complicated these days. i booked through an agent 4 weeks ago and my tickets came today, so i think i am covered, on my invoice is says package holiday. oh well i will have to stow away on a boat or something if anything goes wrong. but thanks again for clarifying things.

To make it easier to understand. If you go into a travel agent and ask them to book you a flight then a hotel you will not be covered by ATOL, but if the flight is a charter that part of the holiday is covered by ATOL, but not your hotel accomodation.

The reason its not a package holiday is because you have used a agent to go a supplier for a flight and then a different supplier for the hotel. But if that agent had its own ATOL number then they will be allowed to sell lets say 100,000 package hoilday as licenced but no more. When a tour applies for a ATOL number they can't sell any amout of holidays they want to ATOL will decide the amount they can sell.

The trouble with many internet diy sites is they will show ATOL but they don't hold a ATOL licence, what they are saying we can book a holiday as a agent with a tour op who has a ATOL licence. A bit under hand if you ask me. But what these diy sites are doing is buying you a flight and a hotel from two different suppliers.

When we go to sites like easyjet they are now doing holidays, but they are not doing hoildays. They have teamed up a hotel supplier and you buy the flight from easyjet and the hotel with the other site even though you do it all through easyjet. Your flight will be a scheduled flight no ATOL protection and then the hotel is not covered by ATOL and the holiday is not covered by the package holiday regulations.

The most important area to look at is your flight, if you book a charted flight then you will not be stranded if the airline folds. So when any of you do a DIY holiday just make sure your flight is a charted flight.

I think it was last year where a budget airline folded and there were people waiting to go on holiday lost their money and people in holiday resorts who were stranded and had to make their own back at their own expense. What looks like a cheap is not always cheap when everything is taken in to account. Its only right people should pay a bit more for the protection ATOL gives. Its not free for companies who apply for a ATOL licence they have pay a amount depending on how many hoilays they are allowed sell.

As I said just make sure your flight is a charted flight, if a flight is cancelled charter airlines have to get you back to the uk as soon as possible where a cheduled operator could wait a week, two weeks until there is room on one of their flights. We had a example recently where easyjet cancelled a flight returning from italy, passengers had to book hotel rooms at their own expense until a flight was available which was 3 days later. Some didn't wait made their own way home by train ferry because easyjet couldn't say when seats would be available to get the stranded passengers home. The people who went overland arrived back at the same time as the easyjet flown passengers. A charter airline would of charted a plane to get people home as soon as possible.

The 3 most used budget airlines are Air Berlin, Easyjet and Ryanair. Unless you book seats when the flights for the next season are put on sell you could pay a lot more than a charted flight. The budget airline are now starting to charge for every piece of luggage that is put in the hold, ryanair is the first and they are charging a £2.50 check in fee at the airports on top of the £5 baggae fee per item.

I try to explain ATOL but its not easy because of all the different rules. When you book a holiday over the net with a company that books a flight and a hotel, phone them before and ask them is all parts of the holiday covered by ATOL and package hoilday regulations. One other thing if the hotel chain folds you will be strand with no where to stay if it isnt ATOL protected. Because they are buying you a hotel and a flight as an agent for you from different suppliers the package holiday regulations don't count. Moves are under way to close the loop hole and bring scheduled airlines into ATOL protection, but how long that will take is not known with a number of airline trying to resisting the move, because it will put their costs up.

Just make sure the flight is a charted flight and then at least you have some protection.

If you want something that will boogle your mind take a look at IATA who represent scheduled airlines, every fare from a scheduled airline is paid to IATA and then they will work out how much the airline will get because your journey might be on 3 or 4 different airline. If somebody wanted a flight to australia and they wanted to stop off in different places all the milage of the journey will have to caculated and the fare worked out and it depends which way around the world they are traveling and a different fare comes in if they stop somewhere like korea. If somebody was going to australia and want to stop off at 4 or 5 different locations the milage would have to be calulated between each stop off and if it is more than the milage allowed to australia a surcharge will be added to the ticket price. Thats trying to put it into simple terms its much more complicated than the above.

I can sell air tickets because I am IATA qualified.

To make it easier to understand. If you go into a travel agent and ask them to book you a flight then a hotel you will not be covered by ATOL

Thats not true if the travel agent holds an atol licence then you are covered as they then become the tour operator

I take note of the atol holding travel agent. The rules are so complicated, like a scheduled flight booked through a atol travel agent if the airline goes bust you are covered, but if the flight is purchased direct from the airline then you are not covered.

PLEASE NOTE: At the moment there is controversy in respect of whether Section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 applies to overseas transactions.

A recent high court ruling said section 75 applies to overseas transactions. I can't remember when the ruling was made.

So we book by credit card on a package tour, fly out, arrive in hotel maybe spend a day there then the company we are with goes bust..

do we contact the credit card, get out money back there and then, pay for the hotel on it, find another flight home?

do we continue the holiday as the hotel has been paid for, then look at getting another flight home at the end of it on the credit card and then claim the lot back once home?

do we make our way directly home on credit card, losing all the holiday time, (and losing the time we have booked off from work etc) and then get only the money we have spent back on the credit card when we get home?

Etc ?

thanks

Steve

hi all,well i am totally confused by all this now,we booked after seeing an offer on travelzoo,s website with "eticket travel" he told us they are abta etc bonded and also the companies they use are eg;flights with thomas cook.as i was going to pay £100 of the deposit with a credit card to secure it and the rest with a debit card he advised me that i actually was doublely covered so no real need to pay with c.c.however i did anyway.we goin to turkey in may and after reading all the above about wether you are or not protected i really dont no wether we are or not.the invoice breaks the hotel,flights,transfers etc down even though i asked if it was a package as it was advertised as one,he said they make there own packages and not to worry as we are covered.
can anyone enlighten me as to wether we are covered or not????
cheers laingy

ARE YOU saying that to book even thomas cook or direct holidays with credit card aswell.Dont quite understand . Got me worried as booked mine already with debit card.

Hi all....rule for safety when booking or buying holidays ect... as given by Rhos holiday solicitor... are basicaly always pay with a credit card...seems to cover all eventualities....seems to many loop holes these days being used to rely on abta or atol...added from me is check you have insurance in place to cover you incase fault is on your side of things...ie illness ect...job loss these days as well

does it only work with credit cards, ie not debit cards ?

Steve

yea credit cards only,for the last 10years i paid with debit card as we dont have any credit cards,but this year i got a pre-paid credit card and paid £100 deposit for hols on it,that covers me completely irrelevant of what travel company we use.the rest was on debit card.hope this helps.
karen

Yes I think it does ! if we pay the minimum deposit on CC and rest on DC is everything covered or just the deposit?
Steve

steve,everything is covered,but im sure you have to pay minimum of £100.
i read that on either atol or abts,a website.
karen

What Karen states is correct.

So if you pay deposit with credit card and remainder on debit card Im sure your credit card will only reinburse what you have paid with them, as when I had booked flights last year for a few family members with xcel and then they folded my credit card company only credited my cards with the payments I made with them.