I went to Egypt twice last year, once in July (Sharm) and again in December (Marsa Alam). Looking to go back this year but the prices are ridiculous because there are so few flights. From Gatwick, my local airport, we've lost 3 weekly BA flights to Sharm (-840 seats), 2 weekly Thomas Cook (-670 seats) flights to Sharm, four weekly Viking flights to Sharm ( -756 seats) as well as one to Hurghada. easyJet have cut a weekly flight to Sharm (-180 seats), Monarch have downgraded one of their weekly flights by 130 seats. Now, the only option to Egypt seems to be Thomson, who have themselves cut around 500 seats this Summer by downgrading flights from the largest aircraft in the fleet to one of the smallest. Thats a reduction of around 3000 seats per week, or a capacity cut of approximately 51% on last summer.
So unfortunately I won't be going to Egypt this year, not because I'm worried about civil unrest, nor because I'm worried about getting bitten by a shark, but because there are no flights left, and the few that are remaining are around £600 return. I could get to Australia and back for that.
The tourism industry in Egypt has been almost destroyed by the events in Jan/Feb this year. Thomson were planning to operate five weekly flights from the UK to Marsa Alam this Winter, this has been cut back to two. They were planning to have four weekly flights to Taba next summer, that is now down to one. Flights from Bristol and Birmingham to Luxor have been canned as have flights to Aswan from Gatwick. Flights to Sharm from Norwich, Edinburgh, Teesside, Belfast and Bournemouth (Summer) have all been cut and the number of services from the rest of the UK have been downgraded.
Things don't seem to be much better from the continent either. Certainly the number of Russian visits, one of Egypt's biggest inbound markets, have decreased.
So is this it for Egypt's tourism industry? It had a two year peak of sustainable mass tourism, but has now gone back to being a fairly exclusive destination, and with all those unfilled hotel rooms due to the flight capacity cuts (3000 fewer seats will result in at least a thousand empty rooms in Sharm each week, just from Gatwick!) it is now anything but sustainable.
I studied Egypt at length during my university studies and its tourism development was all strategically planned to avoid overcapacity. Each new resort had a cap on the number of hotel rooms built to ensure that they weren't lying empty or bringing in more tourists than the local infrastructure and environment can handle. Unfortunately, nothing could have prepared them for the impact the civil unrest has had. Which is a shame, because I found it to be one of the most scenic, friendly and welcoming countries I have ever visited.
I completely agree with your sentiment, such a shame people have been scared off , i love Egypt and its people, also was most annoyed with thomson giving us a smaller aircraft cos we could not even book extra legroom months ago 
Phyll
Phyll
Well I for one hope the TO's change their mind pretty quick about these flights. This Easter was the first time we have stayed in Egypt, and we loved it. We hope to go back next Easter, but as you say - so far prices are ridiculously high. The Egyptian people were so welcoming, they deserve our support 
I can't quote facts and figures as such but when you say prices have gone up,we're looking at going to sharm next year and did look into it last year too and prices seem exactly the same,anywhere between £600 and £1000 for a 3-4 star AI for 2 weeks with the average seemingly at around £800 for places like the grand azure or coral sea,when we looked last year it was about that aswell,with plenty of availability for all dates same as now and for 2012??? I've got quite a few friends that have either just been to sharm or are going there soon and also got a mate that works in the tavern in naama bay,none of them are scared off and nor are we!
That said we've looked and cuba,dom rep,mexico etc are about the same price but with 24 hour AI,but you lose out weather wise as we're looking at late august,but in my opinion caribbean wins hands down,just got to convince the missus!
That said we've looked and cuba,dom rep,mexico etc are about the same price but with 24 hour AI,but you lose out weather wise as we're looking at late august,but in my opinion caribbean wins hands down,just got to convince the missus!
I don't know about other airports, but this year we stayed at the Tropicana Grand Azure for a week at Easter for £720 pp flying from Cardiff. The same dates for next year are £865 pp, an increase of £290 for 2 people - that's a big hike up for me, and seing as it's not my main holiday, I won't be able to afford to go at that price.
we've been looking at 2 weeks at either the grand azure,coral sea resort or maybe one of the nubians on or around august 30th from gatwick and with juggling dates here or there by 2 days or so it's coming up at around £8-850 including 2x extra legroom,so double the amount of days as easter for the same price??? that's with thomson or first choice,both the same obviously,more than i wanted to pay for 2 weeks on the toilet though to be fair hence me trying to convince the OH to go to the caribbean!
Hubby & I both work in a school so our dates are fixed - the most expensive in the calender 
I do think many people paniced and cancelled/changed their holidays to Egypt this year. We went as usual over easter and things did see a sharp increase at that time only for it to seemingly drop again come may.
it broke my heart to see how despondant the Egyptians were at the time . Easter seemed to give them some much needed hope back but i fear if t/o's continue to keep the reduced flight prices inflated they have little hope.
We booked with EJ and that still cost us £400+ each within an hour or two of the prices being released. you can pick up considerable bargains if you book the hotel DIY but whilst the flight prices are still high their efforts are all in vain .
I emailed the hilton 2 weeks before our departure to say the price we had paid had dropped(we had it on a flexible booking) and they reduced it immediately by USD25 per person per night to match the best deal i could get at the time . They were clearly taking no chances n losing another booking .
it broke my heart to see how despondant the Egyptians were at the time . Easter seemed to give them some much needed hope back but i fear if t/o's continue to keep the reduced flight prices inflated they have little hope.
We booked with EJ and that still cost us £400+ each within an hour or two of the prices being released. you can pick up considerable bargains if you book the hotel DIY but whilst the flight prices are still high their efforts are all in vain .
I emailed the hilton 2 weeks before our departure to say the price we had paid had dropped(we had it on a flexible booking) and they reduced it immediately by USD25 per person per night to match the best deal i could get at the time . They were clearly taking no chances n losing another booking .
I think unfortuantly Easter is just about the dearest time to go to Egypt Helen. 
It's one of few options at Easter where you have guaranteed good weather without say flying to the Caribean or somewhere else long haul, and its do able in a week.
In the summer there are lots of options for people, but its mainly Egypt or the Canaries for this kind of one week break that is practical and so many people had been to the Canaries so many times, they were just pleased to have a choice of another destination.
It's the flights that cost the money as 5 to 6 hours in the air is expensive and I the hotels have pared costs to the bone as it is. The money seems to go in taxes and aircraft fuel.
Doe
It's one of few options at Easter where you have guaranteed good weather without say flying to the Caribean or somewhere else long haul, and its do able in a week.
In the summer there are lots of options for people, but its mainly Egypt or the Canaries for this kind of one week break that is practical and so many people had been to the Canaries so many times, they were just pleased to have a choice of another destination.
It's the flights that cost the money as 5 to 6 hours in the air is expensive and I the hotels have pared costs to the bone as it is. The money seems to go in taxes and aircraft fuel.
Doe
I remember a few years ago the government tried to pressure tour operators over their policy of huge price rises during school holidays,i seem to recall the TO's response was a 2 fingered one,supply and demand will always win
Defiantly Sam. I don't think they can do it any other way or I suppose they would all be going bust. (well more than have gone bust already 
).
They must have to increase them in the school hols so that they can balance out the discounting in May, June, Sept, Oct, I would imagine.
Do you have to go in August? I am sure you could get a good deal at the end of October (provided you miss out the half term week) or in November. Sharm etc is normally at it's cheapest them. Also good deals to be had in January.
Only trouble is you lose the daylight early in the winter months and start chasing the sun round the pool, but you could probably save a lot.
Doe
).They must have to increase them in the school hols so that they can balance out the discounting in May, June, Sept, Oct, I would imagine.
Do you have to go in August? I am sure you could get a good deal at the end of October (provided you miss out the half term week) or in November. Sharm etc is normally at it's cheapest them. Also good deals to be had in January.
Only trouble is you lose the daylight early in the winter months and start chasing the sun round the pool, but you could probably save a lot.
Doe
no we go in late august and the price isn't really an issue,obviously paying less is better but we pay whatever we need to pay so to speak,£800 for 2 weeks is alright,
but i'm just thinking caribbean would be better when you get better beaches and 24 hour AI for the same money and it doesnt have the same reputation for erm......the trots!
but i'm just thinking caribbean would be better when you get better beaches and 24 hour AI for the same money and it doesnt have the same reputation for erm......the trots!
LOL, A few years ago the Dom Rep had a serious reputation for the trots But think they cleaned up their act if you'll pardon the pun.
I know what you mean about Egypt, it seems about a 50:50 chance. Also if you are going for 2 weeks it might as well be the carribean, egypt wins out if you only want a week I guess - provided you don't spend it in the loo!
Doe
But think they cleaned up their act if you'll pardon the pun.I know what you mean about Egypt, it seems about a 50:50 chance. Also if you are going for 2 weeks it might as well be the carribean, egypt wins out if you only want a week I guess - provided you don't spend it in the loo!
Doe
I believe the Egyptian tourist board even offered subsidies to airlines and tour operators to stop them reducing capacity for this summer. Clearly that wasn't enough to stop the mass exodus.
In terms of prices, I had 11 nights All Inclusive in the Royal Albatros Moderna last July, including flights with BA, for £550 each. In December we had 7 nights AI at the Brayka Bay resort in Marsa Alam with Thomson for £340 each. I doubt tour operators have purposely put the prices up this year, but with such significant capacity cuts, supply and demand has pushed prices up a lot quicker.
What makes it even harder to bare is Sharm and the coastal regions weren't even affected by the unrest. In fact, the Sinai peninsula is almost a different country to the 'mainland', different laws, government etc. Myself and the girlfriend are keen snorkellers, but unfortunately won't be doing so in the beautiful Red Sea this year.
In terms of prices, I had 11 nights All Inclusive in the Royal Albatros Moderna last July, including flights with BA, for £550 each. In December we had 7 nights AI at the Brayka Bay resort in Marsa Alam with Thomson for £340 each. I doubt tour operators have purposely put the prices up this year, but with such significant capacity cuts, supply and demand has pushed prices up a lot quicker.
What makes it even harder to bare is Sharm and the coastal regions weren't even affected by the unrest. In fact, the Sinai peninsula is almost a different country to the 'mainland', different laws, government etc. Myself and the girlfriend are keen snorkellers, but unfortunately won't be doing so in the beautiful Red Sea this year.
I know it's quite funny talking about the stomach upsets but seriously,if you read hotel reviews on here,trip advisor etc you end up utterly convinced that if you go to egypt you're going to end up spending 3-4 days with the trots,cramps,sweats etc,that to me is the biggest turn off,more so than prices or civil unrest,i know people say plenty of tourists dont get ill at all but you do get a thoroughly overwhelming sense that this is a major feature of 90% of holidays to egypt,now personally speaking that's not something i like the thought of if i dwell on it so if i was planning a holiday for a family with kids i'd be put off.
Maybe what the egyptian tourist board needs to address more than anything is this,so many reviews and topics mention poor hygeine practices,drinks glasses washed by hand under a tap,ice made with tap water,staff rarely washing their hands,bottled water with broken seals,hot buffet food being tipped on top of cold buffet food and so many other factors that it's easy to see why in a general sense,that egypt has this problem,as mentioned above Dom Rep. had a big reputation for this a few years ago and they seem to have managed to get over it so maybe the egyptans need to keep their house in order in this way before they try to tempt more people over?
Maybe what the egyptian tourist board needs to address more than anything is this,so many reviews and topics mention poor hygeine practices,drinks glasses washed by hand under a tap,ice made with tap water,staff rarely washing their hands,bottled water with broken seals,hot buffet food being tipped on top of cold buffet food and so many other factors that it's easy to see why in a general sense,that egypt has this problem,as mentioned above Dom Rep. had a big reputation for this a few years ago and they seem to have managed to get over it so maybe the egyptans need to keep their house in order in this way before they try to tempt more people over?
It all seems to be a bit up in the air at the moment, as to what is happening there. I think we have a person who works in a travel agents on here and apparently Egypt just isn't selling, so I suppose there is not much they can do. I guess it is first timers who aren't prepared to take a chance. There are 100's of holiday destinations out there.
I have been three times and haven't been serioulsy ill, but I am under no illusion that I could go a fourth time and be ill with the sharm shuffle/taba trots. I suspect it's the food, if it was the out door temperatures or the airconditioning as some say then surely 100% of people would be ill, as we are all subject to the same temps and air c o n. Most hotels are AI, the only time I felt vaguely unwell was when I ate a cream cake one lunch time, I reckon the cream hadn't been kept at the right temperature or was on the turn, it was a stupid thing to eat somewhere like Sharm.
At that time the hotels were so busy they just couldn't keep the hygiene going at the buffets although they did their best. I expect hot food was put on cold and people leave the silver covers up to be helpful to the next person etc and hundreds must touch the serving spoons so if someone has a bug or something the next thing you know 50 or 100 have it, depending on how virulant it is.
Shame you can't get there Stevie, I assumed Marsa Alam would still be quite reasonable. I suppose they have cut flights there as well.
I have been three times and haven't been serioulsy ill, but I am under no illusion that I could go a fourth time and be ill with the sharm shuffle/taba trots. I suspect it's the food, if it was the out door temperatures or the airconditioning as some say then surely 100% of people would be ill, as we are all subject to the same temps and air c o n. Most hotels are AI, the only time I felt vaguely unwell was when I ate a cream cake one lunch time, I reckon the cream hadn't been kept at the right temperature or was on the turn, it was a stupid thing to eat somewhere like Sharm.
At that time the hotels were so busy they just couldn't keep the hygiene going at the buffets although they did their best. I expect hot food was put on cold and people leave the silver covers up to be helpful to the next person etc and hundreds must touch the serving spoons so if someone has a bug or something the next thing you know 50 or 100 have it, depending on how virulant it is.
Shame you can't get there Stevie, I assumed Marsa Alam would still be quite reasonable. I suppose they have cut flights there as well.
A week at the same hotel we stayed at in December this August is £800, as apposed to the £340 we paid. That's just summer demand being greater than that of the first week in December. In fact we picked that week out specifically because it was the cheapest week of the year. Unfortunately I can't go in December this year, although even if I could the price for the same week has gone up to £465.
Thomson were supposed to be upgrading their Marsa Alam flights to two weekly from Gatwick and Manchester for this winter, as well as introducing new flights from Birmingham. This would have allowed for 10-11 night stays, rather than just 7 nights which for me is too short, or 14 nights which is too long. Introducing this flexibility in stay duration creates demand in itself.
The same increases were due for Taba, but instead this has now been cancelled completely from Manchester and Birmingham for Summer 2012.
Thomson were supposed to be upgrading their Marsa Alam flights to two weekly from Gatwick and Manchester for this winter, as well as introducing new flights from Birmingham. This would have allowed for 10-11 night stays, rather than just 7 nights which for me is too short, or 14 nights which is too long. Introducing this flexibility in stay duration creates demand in itself.
The same increases were due for Taba, but instead this has now been cancelled completely from Manchester and Birmingham for Summer 2012.
could it just be that thomson aren't planning to sell marsa alam or other resorts anymore,it happens a lot,a tour operator from the UK flogs a resort or area for a few years and then pulls out and flogs somewhere else instead,thomson used to go to say the costa de almeria but now no longer do,or some greek islands and some caribbean destinations,i know in almeria they were pretty prolific at one point and then gradually scaled down their presence there until they pulled out completely,also some destinations just become the playgrounds of other nationalities,look at la arenal on majorca,once popular with brits,now almost exclusively german,whereas magaluf is almost exclusively british. i know i'm waffling a bit but in my head it makes sense,maybe in a few years time taba and marsa will have virtually no guests at all from the UK and somewhere you cant seem to find in the brochures for love nor money will become the latest 'in' place?
Also you might find that next year's flight programs from the small regional UK airports will all change by then based on this year's numbers,would be silly to pay landing and apron fees for norwich for next summer only to find that this summer not enough people book it to make it profitable. i know they do this with all resorts throughout the year,i live on rhodes and sometimes you'll hear from the reps that thomson airways have suddenly dropped 4 of their flights from their program,only to reintroduce them again a month later
Also you might find that next year's flight programs from the small regional UK airports will all change by then based on this year's numbers,would be silly to pay landing and apron fees for norwich for next summer only to find that this summer not enough people book it to make it profitable. i know they do this with all resorts throughout the year,i live on rhodes and sometimes you'll hear from the reps that thomson airways have suddenly dropped 4 of their flights from their program,only to reintroduce them again a month later
The Spanish destinations have been gradually dropped by the tour operators because of the emergence of low cost airlines, which now dominate the UK-Spain market. Thomas Cook now only have one flight a week from Gatwick to the Spanish mainland, for example. There's been no reduction in seats between the UK-Spain (quite the contrary) but the balance has gradually shifted from charter airlines/tour operators to low cost airlines.
Caribbean destinations are mainly dropped due to poor customer reviews. Certainly this was the case with Margarita. Other destinations, such as Brazil, were dropped when local authorities withdrew subsidies to UK tour operators. High oil prices have also made long haul flying unpopular with tour operators.
As it is now, Taba and Marsa Alam do have virtually no guests at all from the UK. Marsa Alam is dominated by Italians. But unlike Spain, which for the most part is in the decline stage of the destination/product life cycle, Egypt is a developing tourist destination - Marsa Alam airport only opened in 2003! Thomson planned to increase the number of flights from the UK to Marsa Alam to five weekly flights this Winter but reverted back to the two flights per week (one from MAN, one from LGW), as has been the case for the past 3-4 years.
Spain never had a blanket reduction in seats from the UK, Egypt has. There are 54% fewer (I forgot about a Monarch flight on a Saturday last year that doesn't operate this year) seats to Sharm from Gatwick this year, the equivilent of 17 A320 loads each week.
Caribbean destinations are mainly dropped due to poor customer reviews. Certainly this was the case with Margarita. Other destinations, such as Brazil, were dropped when local authorities withdrew subsidies to UK tour operators. High oil prices have also made long haul flying unpopular with tour operators.
As it is now, Taba and Marsa Alam do have virtually no guests at all from the UK. Marsa Alam is dominated by Italians. But unlike Spain, which for the most part is in the decline stage of the destination/product life cycle, Egypt is a developing tourist destination - Marsa Alam airport only opened in 2003! Thomson planned to increase the number of flights from the UK to Marsa Alam to five weekly flights this Winter but reverted back to the two flights per week (one from MAN, one from LGW), as has been the case for the past 3-4 years.
Spain never had a blanket reduction in seats from the UK, Egypt has. There are 54% fewer (I forgot about a Monarch flight on a Saturday last year that doesn't operate this year) seats to Sharm from Gatwick this year, the equivilent of 17 A320 loads each week.
There is no doubt that the major influence in the decline in bookings has been the civil unrest, bookings for both Egypt & Tunisia have been particularly badly affected. Both countries were developing tourist destinations and were and ideal mix of a slightly longer haul destination, with good hotels and reasonable prices and almost guaranteed sunshine.
Tour operators have had to take a decision to cancel and consolidate flights on commercial grounds, with the price of oil they can't continue to operate with planes flying to destinations half empty and hotel beds not occupied, most tour operators and airlines have cut back their destinations and available flights for the winter and beyond, a typical example is Ryanair who will be grounding at least 80 aircraft (almost one third of their current fleet) for the winter, which represents an increase of 100% on last year.
We have 2 weeks in January booked and should have been flying from Edinburgh with Thomson however the Edinburgh flights are cancelled for winter 2011/2012 and we are now flying a few days earlier from Glasgow.
Pricewise all flights / holidays are more expensive due to the the current economic crisis and particularly the price of oil, having said that I am happy with our price of £1195 for 2 weeks for 2 of us A.I. at the Tropicana.
Tour operators have had to take a decision to cancel and consolidate flights on commercial grounds, with the price of oil they can't continue to operate with planes flying to destinations half empty and hotel beds not occupied, most tour operators and airlines have cut back their destinations and available flights for the winter and beyond, a typical example is Ryanair who will be grounding at least 80 aircraft (almost one third of their current fleet) for the winter, which represents an increase of 100% on last year.
We have 2 weeks in January booked and should have been flying from Edinburgh with Thomson however the Edinburgh flights are cancelled for winter 2011/2012 and we are now flying a few days earlier from Glasgow.
Pricewise all flights / holidays are more expensive due to the the current economic crisis and particularly the price of oil, having said that I am happy with our price of £1195 for 2 weeks for 2 of us A.I. at the Tropicana.
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