hi....a few points come to mind
1/Each country issues its own notes and have a letter prefixed to identify them...why would this be necessary
answer....each countries original currency will have been accesed ....and xamount of pesatas lira francs or drachema would have been needed for each euro they were allowed to issue....
Though it was never supposed to happen ..there would have had to be some inbuilt accountability ...a way of buying back the euros from a country who in the future wished to revert back to its original currency....hence the prefixed letter
Once the correct amount of euros were originaly agreed for each country the trading situation would be on an even playing field....the euro would have a common value....
There after each country would have been able to print and issue replacements for worn out notes of there own country....or if their national wealth had risen from trading outside of the euro ect... and it would all be under the control of the euro bank....notes printed for this reason would also have the country's prefixed letter on them...
2/ How would they be able to sort out what was owed by the euro bank to Greece if she wanted to leave the euro...in otherwords...close her account.
answer...the reverse of when she opened her account (joined the euro)....Greece's assets will be valued...her national wealth accessesed...a new value given to the drachma...which would then be valued against the euro.....and an exchange rate will be agreed
When Greece joined the euro she basicaly deposited the countries monetary assets (drachemas)...and was given the equivalent value in euros...in otherwords she paid for each euro with x amount of drachema....( the euros become the equivalent of a promisary note )
In order to give Greece her money back....the euros (promisary notes)with the greek letter pre-fix need counting....and Greece will be given the drachemas she paid for them back.....so if she paid 100 drachema for each euro...she would get 100 drachema back for each euro...Greece would give back those held in her own vaults ...and banks would return the identifiable greek notes and coins ...accepting them over the counter but taking them out of circulation...and they would eventualy be destroyed by the euro bank..
The drachema would have an exchange value on the world markets...thats when the **** will hit the fan
Technicaly each euro note with the pre-fix letter for Greece is worth xamount of drachemas...and technicaly you are owed xamount of drachemas for each one you posses.....and would technicaly recieve pounds in exchange according to the exchange rate between the drachema and the pound...
If Greece defaulted ...and was basicaly bankrupt...there would be very little if any value in the drachema....so technically your greek euros would be worthless...
3/ Would I own worthless euros
answer....in my opinion no....you purchases euros in good faith...your contract is in the first person with the euro bank...who have agreed a common value for each euro.... what may happen is the greek euro being refused as payment because shop keepers ect think it is worth less....and the greek euros could be recalled...and you would have so long to exchange them for non greek euros...
Thats how I think....anyone got other ideas
Tweetie, everything you say assumes that a banknote is actually backed up by something tangible which has some sort of value but it doesn't. It used to when each country's central bank had gold reserves equivalent to the banknotes in circulation but those days were over once the Gold Standard was dropped. When the Euro came into being those countries that went into the common currency didn't 'buy' their Euros with their Drachma, Marks and Pesetas etc like you and I would - the banking system doesn't work like that.
We've heard a lot about the Bank of England and 'Quantitative Easing' during our own recession but all it means is that they've literally been printing more money and pushing it out into circulation via the other banks. The idea was that they would then 'lend' it to businesses etc to kick start the economy but we all know they haven't. That statement on £sterling notes that the Governor of the Bank of England promises to pay the bearer One Pound is meaningless - they don't actually have anything tangible to give you in return - just another banknote. If it did then the value of currencies against each other wouldn't change they way they do - they'd remain exactly the same forever. But they do because the currency market is literally a gamble - the strong currencies are those which dealers think are backed by strong economies and which can repay their borrowing. And in monetary terms the Eurozone is one big single unit - currently propped up by the German economy and the other reasonably healthy economies within it. And why if the Greek 'Euro' goes down it will take the whole pack of cards with it.
Also, if your assumptions were correct we wouldn't ever have any inflation because there'd be a finite amount of 'money' in circulation - inflation is basically another way of describing central banks printing money whilst trying to keep their economies afloat . I know I'm not doing a very good job of explaining this but currency and banking systems are little more than smoke and mirrors. And this is why they collapse when we all start to see through their illusions.
SM
We've heard a lot about the Bank of England and 'Quantitative Easing' during our own recession but all it means is that they've literally been printing more money and pushing it out into circulation via the other banks. The idea was that they would then 'lend' it to businesses etc to kick start the economy but we all know they haven't. That statement on £sterling notes that the Governor of the Bank of England promises to pay the bearer One Pound is meaningless - they don't actually have anything tangible to give you in return - just another banknote. If it did then the value of currencies against each other wouldn't change they way they do - they'd remain exactly the same forever. But they do because the currency market is literally a gamble - the strong currencies are those which dealers think are backed by strong economies and which can repay their borrowing. And in monetary terms the Eurozone is one big single unit - currently propped up by the German economy and the other reasonably healthy economies within it. And why if the Greek 'Euro' goes down it will take the whole pack of cards with it.
Also, if your assumptions were correct we wouldn't ever have any inflation because there'd be a finite amount of 'money' in circulation - inflation is basically another way of describing central banks printing money whilst trying to keep their economies afloat . I know I'm not doing a very good job of explaining this but currency and banking systems are little more than smoke and mirrors. And this is why they collapse when we all start to see through their illusions.
SM
Also theres the scaremongering that goes on which can only do harm and start the cycle of destruction! Just like the petrol scare of a couple of months ago. As soon as it starts getting reported in the press, eveyone starts to fill up their cars, then everyone who didn't fill up their cars see's all the queues at the petrol stations and thinks they'd better fuel up now or they may run out! It's just a knock on effect.
I see this happening to Greece, I'm guessing there will be a lot less people hollidaying in Greece this year because of all the goings on and this will then mean less money coming into Greece causing jobs to go and Greece's econony will get worse and worse and the Greeks will think they may get kicked out of the euro so they'll start to demand their money out of the banks, but obviously the banks don't really have their money so the banks will dry up, lending will go down, and on and on!
Infact I can see all the shop owners etc in Spain or France or Germany start sorting out all their Greek euro notes and passing them off as 'change' to all us lovely holiday makers, just in case!
I see this happening to Greece, I'm guessing there will be a lot less people hollidaying in Greece this year because of all the goings on and this will then mean less money coming into Greece causing jobs to go and Greece's econony will get worse and worse and the Greeks will think they may get kicked out of the euro so they'll start to demand their money out of the banks, but obviously the banks don't really have their money so the banks will dry up, lending will go down, and on and on!
Infact I can see all the shop owners etc in Spain or France or Germany start sorting out all their Greek euro notes and passing them off as 'change' to all us lovely holiday makers, just in case!
TWEETIE PIE wrote:hi....a few points come to mind
1/Each country issues its own notes and have a letter prefixed to identify them...why would this be necessary
answer....each countries original currency will have been accesed ....and xamount of pesatas lira francs or drachema would have been needed for each euro they were allowed to issue....
I'm not sure if they would still have a direct Euro conversion rate back to what the original currency was at the time of them adopting the Euro
How would that work, I cant see any money being coverted back at the same rate it was converted over, that would be too simplstic as it wouldn't take into account any of the economic factors that had taken place in the interim?
Cant get my head round it, but my gut feeling is it isn't going to happen. I'm going to Spain soon, maybe I will get Euros in Spain & be conservative with what I change up & not bring any home. I dont think I will be bothering with checking which country they were printed in on a 'just in case basis' while I am out there though.
I'm still relying on the fact that it was mainly Germany, Benlux & France that wanted a federated Europe with one currency & they will find a way to save the Greek Euro otherwise the whole thing will have turned out pointless.
I rememeber the days of Norman Lamont & the particular day that everyone sat in the office & their mortgage was going up every hour due to what at that time was called 'the exchange rate mechanism' & all being terrified, like millions of young Brits with mortgages were - but then he pulled out at the end of the day. Phew!
But I woudn't wish that feeling on anyone. I don't know if Greeks go in for mortgages, it looks like a place where houses are handed down from generation to generation & they stick another, half built room on if they need more space.
Doe
I rememeber the days of Norman Lamont & the particular day that everyone sat in the office & their mortgage was going up every hour due to what at that time was called 'the exchange rate mechanism' & all being terrified, like millions of young Brits with mortgages were - but then he pulled out at the end of the day. Phew!
I remember that day very well too, Doe, especially since I was at a tricky stage of trading up and buying a house up here in Scotland where an offer is most definitely legally binding - none of this 'subject to contract' stuff here. My old house was already sold and I was staying with friends as a temporary measure, the offer on the house I wanted had gone in and been accepted, an entry date agreed (when the money would have to be paid over no matter what) but the mortgage was still being finalised. And I watched the interest rates climb throughout the day with a great pit opening in front of me as the mortgage looked like it would become totally unaffordable. There was no point in hoping that the sellers would be in a similar position and that we could perhaps negotiate putting the deal on hold because it was an executor sale - they'd been watching the interest rates climb too and their solicitor had already been in touch with mine to say that they expected me to honour the sale come what may or they'd see me in court for breach of contract. Nightmare - so I certainly have some idea of what the Greek people are going through too.
SM
I remember lots of people at their desks with calculators constantly re-calcuating how much their mortgaes where going up during the course of the day - I'm not sure how long ago but it was probably before the internet really took off so no idea how we were all getting our information, radio perhaps ? I know we are a bit 
but I think it's a good barometer for trying to get our head round what the Greeks may be going through at the present time.
Doe
but I think it's a good barometer for trying to get our head round what the Greeks may be going through at the present time.Doe
Doe, 'Black Wednesday' was the 16th September 1992 - the then Conservative Government couldn't keep the value of the £sterling above the agreed lower limit for it within the ERM and was forced to withdraw after it just kept dropping in value no matter how high they kept shifting the interest rates. I gave up playing the 'what if' game when the bank rate hit 15% - if it stayed at that level I knew that I was in trouble no matter what. Having stretched myself to buy a house right at the top of my budget in the first place, there was no way that I could have afforded those sort of increases in the monthly payments. Thankfully, as you say, the panic receded when we dropped out of the ERM instead.
SM
SM
Well, I've bitten the bullet and ordered half of my euros a few minutes ago. I've been keeping a daily eye on the rates over the past 10 days and after peaking at 1.25 on Wednesday it fell to 1.23 today so I didn't want to risk a further decline. I've hedged my bets and only ordered half the amount I want so if the rate increases again around the Greek elections I will order the rest. If however, it keeps falling, at least I'll have got some at a decent rate 
It's should all feel like a decent rate after the last few years of 1.05 and 1.10!
That's true Chivas. Hubby only asked me this morning what we got last time and it was about 1.10, so I'm happy with this latest rate.
Probably the best way of looking at it!
If a pint was 2 euros at 1.10, at 1.22 it works out about 18p cheaper per pint!
Sorry, I tend to do all my maths in pints!
If a pint was 2 euros at 1.10, at 1.22 it works out about 18p cheaper per pint!
Sorry, I tend to do all my maths in pints!
Just had my euros delivered and most of the notes were issued in Germany, whilst I also have notes from Italy, France and belgium. Not one Greek note amongst them. They are mostly of middle to low denominations too but there are 2 x 100 euro notes.
So that's half my holiday money changed. Keeping an eye to see if the rate rises now before getting amy more.
So that's half my holiday money changed. Keeping an eye to see if the rate rises now before getting amy more.
Tesco is way down on Martin Lewis' list today - only giving 1.20 Euros to the £1. You did right to buy when you did Shirley I'm holding on in the hope it'll go back up before long.
I'm holding on in the hope it'll go back up before long.
Helen T wrote:Tesco is way down on Martin Lewis' list today - only giving 1.20 Euros to the £1. You did right to buy when you did Shirley
Think when greece went to the polls back in april/may, thats when we seen the euro rate start to rise, now are we going to see the same next week, when they go once more to vote, and spain gets bailed out
Round april/may the euro rate was around 1.20/1.21, after hte greek election we started to see the euro climb to 1.24, so hoping the current news items, greece elctions, spain bailout, push the euro above 1.26 or higher
Well I'll be buying next week then - don't see much point in holding out any longer 
That when I will be buying aswell, just maybe after the greece elctions, just waiting on a bank transfer from my share account, and in the last week, my share plan has jumped up by £5000
That's what I call a good investment
Tesco wasn't at the top of the list when I bought Helen but the ones above were charging a fee for using cc so I was better off with the Tesco rate and no cc fee I have only bought half my whack and will probably buy the rest next week.
I have only bought half my whack and will probably buy the rest next week.
Think I will probably jump on in and order mine in the next week or so, six weeks and two days to go yipee 
six weeks and two days for me too now!
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