Cruises

Discussions relating to Cruising holidays
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hi phil
where are they :hmmm can't find them. I hope I wont be :oops: vivien
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I've just spent a couple of hours reading the last 6 months of posts in this thread, and some in related threads.
In October 2004 I was allocated and accepted a cruise to the Carribean departing today, 5th November 2005.
I'm still here, of course. It was cancelled months ago, in a phone call from Rise Travel after I declined to pay £799 to upgrade the allocated cabin. I refused the "book of discount vouchers", which were worthless given the conditions attached to their use and said I would wait until 2006 for the cruise to be reallocated.
Since then, nothing. To be honest, I thought the chance of ever getting a Carribean cruise for £10 were remote, especially after reading many posts on ZDnet and hearing of the expose on TV.
However, these sort of s_c_a_m_s really annoy me, and I'm still hanging onto the dream. The D**** E****** made a lot of sales with the huge screaming headlines, and filled a lot of pages of their paper with this promotion.
In my opinion, it was always intended to disqualify as many people as possible with the large number of T's & C's, and the considerable "flexibility" required to take advantage of the offer was sure to force many people out when they were allocated dates (and destinations) they couldn't or wouldn't take up. Refuse the initial offer - any offer - and that's your lot...!
Many more could be disqualified as a result of not confirming within the tight deadlines, not using the very expensive Special Delivery (Recorded Delivery was not allowed, I recall), or using standard mail and being unable to prove they'd replied.

I suspect the number of people posting - or even reading posts here - is a TINY proportion of those who applied - by that I mean a TINY percentage of 1%.
This would also explain why an organisation like the D**** E****** hasn't bitten the bullet and just bought cruises for those who qualified. If there were 40,000 people - a figure I have seen mentioned - even at £250 each this would have cost them £10 million! Far too much to justify settling... someone probably decided the bad press would have to be put up with until enough people had given up to bring the bill down, meanwhile the trickle of cheap unfilled places on cruises (that it had always been intended to use) has been used to send a handful of (perhaps the loudest!) people away. Note that nowhere, throughout this saga, here, in letters, on Watchdog - anywhere- has the DE ever revealed how many people have been on a cruise, and what proportion of the qualifying number of people that is...I leave it to readers to wonder why this is...
The tone of this Board has changed over the month, due to the tendency for those who HAVE been on a cruise to provide a disproportionate number of posts, giving the impression of many people going away and having a great time. Nice to hear how they've got on, but let's not lose sight of the fact that these are probably the tiny minority, and even then, probably still not a representative proportion of the total due a cruise, the vast proportion of which probably just sighed and thought "well, it did sound too good to be true - oh well, nothing lost" - and who would never have thought of or bothered to enter "D**** E****** £10 Cruise" into Search Engines...if they were computer literate...!

Personally, I hope the idea of leasing a ship for a cruise isn't an option, as this would probably be arranged to cost as little as possible, and that would probably mean the Med, somewhere I've spent a lot of time, and can get to very cheaply. I was allocated the Carribean, somewhere I've never been, and that's where I want to go...!
Given the likelihood of being offered dates not entirely suitable to me, locations I wouldn't have chosen, given free choice, the possibility of being unable to go by the time a cruise is offered due to work, health, accident or whatever, and the draconian possibility of having to pay the full cost of the cruise if I failed to catch the ship for some reason, I'd look favourably at a cash offer if it was reasonable and I could then buy a cruise at my leisure without having to add too much to the pay out...otherwise I intend to continue asking the Daily Express where my Carribean Cruise is, and I hope others will continue to ask too.
It would be nice to hear, if there are any lawyers reading, whether a Small Claims Court action (perhaps claiming £1144 which I think was the figure mentioned somewhere as being the cost of a [second] place on a cruise if you wanted to take a friend or partner) would stand a good chance.
In any event a class action taken out by one person, funded by voluntary contributions (given the number of people standing to gain this wouldn't need to be a lot- I've taken these out before) might be worth considering. If one person does this and wins, it should set a precedent for everyone else...
Although the timescale for the allocation of cruises was somewhat open-ended, I think T's & C's have to be reasonable, and after a period of time, which would have to be decided by a judge, it would be open to him or her to decide that the promoter had failed to honour their promise and was therefore in breach of contract...
(Of course, if the promoter was deemed to be R*** T***** they'd probably just be forced into bankruptcy)
Comments anyone?
Steve.
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Hi Steve :)

Welcome to HT and glad you managed to plough your way through six months of posts some, well quite a lot, :offtop This has been as a way of encouragement and support to the many people waiting and we have found humour has helped as it reached a stage many months ago when it seemed our hands were tied and there wasn't much we could do except take a light-hearted approach and offer encouragement to those waiting. This wasn't to the detriment of offering serious suggestions should anything viable come to light, but nothing much has I'm afraid.

I think it was always necessary to be very flexible for the £10 offer and I myself was expecting to be given an actual date and destination not necessarily of my choosing. My ideal choice (and I suspect most people's) would have been S.America, Caribbean etc. and should I be given an unsuitable date and not my favourite destination I did not expect that I would be able to alter it. In fact I was put in that situation and had to cancel another holiday to take the supposed Libya cruise and I lost my deposit. But this was acceptable to me for £10. I was lucky that my constant emailing and phoning at the right time resulted in a Med cruise as a replacement. I think if a 'block' booking of a ship were to be made now to clear the backlog it would have to be accepted whether or not it was to everyone's liking.

I believe if any action were to be taken, the issue of presumed likely disqualification (and I totally agree with your assumptions here, but travel insurance would cover some of the scenarios), destinations, flexibility etc. wouldn't really be an issue regarding the breach of contract and I think the situation with regard to Rise could provide a get-out. :roll:

I agree with a lot of your comments, especially regarding the number of applicants and I think to ascertain the possibility of legal action someone will have to bite the bullet and actually pay for half an hour's legal advice as should anyone with any relevant legal standing have been reading this I feel sure they would have commented by now as to any court action and to the best way forward.

Alli
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Good Morning from the Balcony :D :D :D :D

Welcome Dolphin999 :bow

You are right on many counts, except that on the cruise I was on (10th Oct) there were 6 D.E. (Joan, Bill, Jean, 2 Ladies from Swanage and 1 grey haired lady) Readers who has not heard of H.T. prior to them us on the cruise, :pele so there is hope for readers who quaified and not being members of this site (On our cruise there was only 4 members of H.T. Vivien, Chis63, Rumrat and yours truly) so it could be said we were out numbered - (there were other brits on the cruise byt some stayed all alone - and we only saw them on the coach home) - on the coach out to start the cruise we were all fagged out, and I doubt if we'd have noticed where we were, except Vivien who seemed to be wide awake and counting the tunnels.

So hang on in there and keep up the presure - how about joining our forthcoming :?: protest of the porn kings pile ? As for the'class action' I'm game for £10 to start it off any other support out there ?
Just looked no photo's yet, not to worry Vivien - the only one that might make the relatuionsw worry is the one of you 'shaking your stuff' :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl

back to bed now, only up because number 1 left G/C here to watch the fireworks from the Balcony I was awoken by 'Carn't sleep granpa can I get in your bed - read me a story' Started and then gave them a drink :evil: of Granpa's pop.

Bye Bye

Phil :kiss
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Hi Steve and welcome
:D I have just read your post and agree with most of what you said. However I am totally convinced that I would not have received a cruise if I had not found the HT site. I didn't realise that aything was wrong at first. I received the allocation letter for the non-existent Libya cruise. It was a few weeks after that that I became worried. I had arranged time off etc and when no further communication was made, I decided to look on the internet. I just put Daily Express in to the browser and up came ZDnet. I stuck with this for a while and then the thread was cut because of the threat of legal action. The last post I read advised people to log on to the HT site. I did this and the rest as they say is history! Finding out that hundreds of HT users were in the same boat (no pun intended :? ) galvanised me into action. With the help of Maureen and Magsy to name but a few, I started to make a fuss, phoning daily (the cost of phone bills alone would have paid for a full cost cruise!) contacting the ASA and Watchdog. I turned down all alternative offers but came to a halt when they then said I had to wait until 2006. It was then that I saw that some HT members were being offered a shared cruise. So I decided that I would go down that route. I had a brilliant time on the Melody and while I suppose I didn't get the £10 cruise as promised, the compromise was well worth it. As you say the promoters are relying on the fact that as time goes by, more and more people will give up or accept alternatives. That is why I think this site is so important - while there are still people accessing this site and encouraging each other I think there is more of a chance that the DE will have to honour its promises. I think your idea re legal action is great but a little difficult to organise. Like Phil, I too would be prepared to contribute towards costs. Perhaps we should start a thread asking for donations? Could we do this Luci :?:
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Good Morning from the Very Wet Balcony :D :D :D :D

The drips from the souwester keep hitting the keys. :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl

My Gran (God Bless) always said "it always rains after Guy Faulkes" and I think year on year has proved her to be correct. :tut

Anyway, sorry to digress as we must keep on topic :omg
I have just looked, No Photos yet. So the Nation is spared the blushes of Vivien and the rest of the 10th Oct D.E. Cruise entertaining the passengers as we left Malta. :hyper :hyper

Bye Bye for now

Phil :kiss
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I think, Phil, the fact that a number of people who were on a cruise having got it by collecting DE vouchers weren't users of this Forum doesn't mean they weren't some of those who shouted loudest and/or most often...there are other Forums, and individuals who have been successful may also have used other means like local radio in their area, a deluge of personal phone calls and/or emails, visiting the DE offices - or being a brother of a DE Director, threats or knee-capping.... :yikes Just kidding.
But allocations could just be random, of course. I do accept that.

If anyone gets a compensation (cash) offer, please post details on here. What people will accept is going to vary depending on a lot of very individual factors , and some of those factors will vary all the time depending on individual circumstances and prospects (if they offer me ten grand I'm going to take it...) :rofl
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Hi Dolphin999 and welcome to HT.

I remember reading some posts a while ago of people being offered cash instead of the cruise. It varied between £100 and £250 I believe.

The cruise I was on, Melody 26th Sept, had 4 HT members including myself. The other 4 people on our dinner table had not heard of this web site and were also DE cruisers. At the next table were another 8 DE cruisers - again no HT members. So, of the 16 people, 25% were members of this web site. There have been a lot of cruises with non HT members. I personally have never phoned R.I.S.E. or the DE. Indeed the only noise I have made has been on this forum.

I sincerely hope that you are offered a cruise soon but I think you should forget about it being the Caribbean. They seem to be offering Red Sea cruises at the moment. Would that not be to your liking?

PHIL We are all waiting with baited breath to see your photos....... :yikes
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Hi JennieL
:D :D :D :D
So am I

Covens :omg just arrived so must dash :argue

Phil
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Hi Dolphin and welcome to HT.
I am a bit of a number cruncher and in my estimation of things, approximately 25% of the people who actually got cruises were HT members. Since the total number of HT members who got cruises is approximately 170, again in my estimation, only 680 people have actually been successful which is an insignificant number in relation to over 40000 applications! Of course it is quite disturbing that no one has yet revealed any actual figures, either the DE or R***! Perhaps an approach to the Minister for Consumer Affairs might just elicit a little more information!!!

Good luck to all of you still waiting!
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Wey-Hey!!

Magsy is back in the saddle of her turbo-charged calculator and all is well with the world once again! :lol:

:kiss
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Hi Steve/Dolphin999 and welcome to HT!

I have added your name to the Who's Going Where/When topic at the top of this forum as an unconfirmed cruiser on 5 November.

There was a trickle of bookings a couple of weeks ago on either the Red Sea Magic or Colourful Coasts cruises, but nothing since. Watchdog have still to do a follow up to their previous article so it may be worth contacting them.

luci :wave
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The Upload album in the Photo Galleries has had to be removed temporarily so Phil's photos are not available at the moment. We hope to have this back very soon.

luci :wave
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Good news indeed from the Balcony the main brace has been set - the totties are out and a fair wind set (Magsy is back on the Block) :D :D :D :D

Welcome back Love you have been sorely missed. you are a font of knowledge :bow (next to Luci that is) :bow Drinks all round.

Phil :kiss
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Hi Steve
Welcome to Ht.
Did you see the post about someone on the Znet thread taking DE and Mkm to court?
The case was over the free flights offer, DE and Mkm failed to appear or be represented, so he sent the baliffs in!
The person says their occupation is LAWYER and gives an email address.
Might be worth starting there.
Anyway check znet
http://www.zdnet.co.uk/talkback/?PROCESS=show&ID=20039306&AT=39165536-39020342t-10000016c
http://www.zdnet.co.uk/talkback/?PROCESS=show&ID=20044030&AT=39165536-39020342t-10000016c

Those of us that have been on our DE cruises keep posting to encrouage those still waiting, and if you look on the 'Whos going where' you will see that there are many :cry:
We as Ht members made a lot of noise but everyone still hasn't got a cruise, but still advise everyone to keep at 'em.

Peter
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I did see that mention of successful court action, but somehow the way it was thrown in made me instinctively feel uneasy about whether it was true.

I'd prefer the Carribean to the other destinations mentioned, but I don't know a lot about them. Where does the Red Sea and the other one mentioned go? (OK, I know, the Red Sea...but what ports, in what order?)

I know getting a cruise offer - ANY cruise offer out of the DE is likely to be a long shot, and I also was expecting to have to take whereever and whenever I was given (of course the offer I did get bore no resemblance to the three months I originally selected as my preferred dates), but having been offered the Carribean, and having spent a ridiculous sum of money writing back by Special Delivery - when Recorded would have acheived the same thing but was specifically forbidden - to accept it, I'd like to go to the Carribean, please...!

How many posts do I need to make to get a STAR, and what fabulous benefits will I receive once I am so qualified? I wait with bated breath....(Where's that damned tube of toothpaste?)

Steve.
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Hi Steve,
How many posts do I need to make to get a STAR, and what fabulous benefits will I receive once I am so qualified? I wait with bated breath....(Where's that damned tube of toothpaste?)



You may wish to `unabate` your breath about now! :lol:

You get points by posting in the main holiday part of the HT forum (not here in General Chat).............and what do points make?

...............No, not prizes, but stars.

The stars are for..................ermmm..............making you feel wanted or something and have no monetary value, just the kudos of feeling superior. :shock: :lol:

Previously there was a reward scheme for points whereby you could exchange HT points for merchandise from the HT goodies section or donate them to the pet charity, but that is no longer available.

In the words of Luci somewhere in the distant past, getting lots of points/stars makes one a `wobblegob`.........such sophistication from one so young!! :rofl :glynis

So there it is............bate not your breath unnecessarily in the future. :lol:
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Great to see magsy back :D :D Steve, I have some details of those alternative cruises mentioned. In fact, I have a friend who lives in Scotland who has been given an alternative cruise. She has never posted on this sight either. However, she did involve her local MP! The cruise she is going on is called 'Red Sea Magic Fly Cruise.' She is going 5th January 2006. The cruise line is Thomson. The ship is called Thomson Spirit and the itinerary: Sharm El Sheik; Jordan; Cairo; Luxor. Hope that helps! I have looked on the web and this cruise currently costs £475. I think the Colourful Coasts Cruise is also a Thomson cruise which cruises round the Canaries. I don't suppose there is much chance of a Caribbean cruise :( :(
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TonyW wrote:
(not here in General Chat)

Errrm you're not in General Chat at the moment Tonykins. Looks like you spend too much time in there and it's addled your brain!

Posts here in the Cruise section certainly do count towards your post count. After you have made 10 posts in any of the holiday discussion forums you will be rewarded with a lovely star under your name. However you may have a long wait (or go on a posting frenzy) to get your second one. :wink: :lol:

luci :wave
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