Do I remember a new ruling that comes into force on the 17th ? tomorrow, about receiving compensation for overbooking. Would this not apply as you are flying after the 17th when the new ruling comes into force ? or does anyone know different?

it wouldnt apply in this case, you havent been bumped off the flight and you can still go on holiday.

These things always happen, just see what you can get at the airport and enjoy your holiday, please!

I don't see why you should cancel your holiday. But see what you can get. Even if it is a seat at the back where you can recline without having knees in your back, (Other than your own, which may be twisted!) Could you not sit in the cabin crew seats for the main bit of the flight, then in your own for take off, landing etc... explain your discomfort. Maybe someone in premium could swap seats with you for a few hours for a bit of a bribe? I would sit in a smaller seat for 5 hours on a 10 hour flight.

The cabin crew would have none of that (Safety Reasons) sorry dramaqueen, they were good suggestions.

I suspect with the new european ruling that came into force today that it will only affect flights from today. Don't hold your breath yet on this ruling as I gather the airlines are going to make a legal challenge in the European Court!!

Here is what Ros Fernihough Travel Law Solicitor has to say regarding this new ruling:-

NEW LEGISLATION IN FORCE with effect from 17th February 2005 relating to air passenger delays and overbooking

The European Union has agreed a new law - not yet in force - which will give passengers on flights more rights in respect of delays. The new rules for compensation are as follows:

1. Delayed flights:

The European Parliament has voted to increase the levels of statutory compensation paid to passengers who have been bumped from overbooked flights. This scheme is also extended to cover charter flights booked as part of a package holiday. The scheme has bitterly been opposed by budget airlines such as Easyjet and Ryanair, however the EU Transport Commissioner Loyola de Palacio stated that the new regulations would also oblige airlines to call for volunteers to give up their seats in exchange for advantages and only if insufficient volunteers came forward would they be allowed to deny passengers boarding against their will.

As well as financial compensation, passengers who are bumped will continue to have the choice of a refund of the cost of their ticket or an alternative flight, together with meals, refreshments and hotel accommodation if the alternative cannot be arranged until the following day. These provisions are included in the current EU Denied Boarding Compensation Scheme which date from 1991. The compensation scheme is extended to cover all charter flights including those sold as part of a package holiday.

Passengers of EU carriers returning to the EU from a third country, if that country has no compensation scheme of it's own in place, are also covered. Under the terms of the 1991 regulations airlines were not obliged to compensate passengers bumped from flights departing from non-EU countries.

Furthermore the new levels of compensation will apply to cancelled flights by airlines or tour operators on their own responsibility unless the passenger is offered an alternative leaving at a time very close to that of their original flight, or has been informed of the cancellation at least two weeks prior to their intended departure.

There will be no statutory compensation for passengers whose flights have been delayed but airlines will be obliged to offer meals, refreshments and hotel accommodation where applicable together with a refund, if the delay lasts for at least 5 hours.

The new rules will be phased in and will be fully applied by 2005.

(a) after a delay of 2 hours on a flight up to 1,500 kms; 3 hours on a flight of 1,500 - 3,500 kms; 4 hours on flights longer than 3,500 kms - passengers will be entitled to free food, drink, phonecalls and emails

(b) after a delay of 5 hours passengers will receive a full refund if they decide not to use the flight

(c) if a flight is delayed overnight passengers are entitled to free hotel accommodation

2. Cancelled flights

(a) If a flight is cancelled passengers will be entitled to a full refund

(b) Except in extraordinary circumstances airlines must inform passengers of cancellations more than 2 weeks before departure. Compensation for failing to do so is paid on top of the refund which is as follows:

(All compensation quoted in Euros - see below £ sterling equivalent)

For cancelled flights and/or denied boarding:

Shorthaul under 930 miles ... ...............£172.00
Mid-range under 2,175 miles .............. £275.00
Long-haul over 2,175 miles ................. £412.00

It would appear that unlike the rules concerning delays, airlines will be able to avoid paying compensation for cancellations if they are due to exceptional circumstances which could not be avoided by them taking reasonable action - this could include bad weather and strikes by Air Traffic Control, Political instability or Terrorists threats. However it does NOT include technical problems on aircraft -

FIVE STEPS TO CLAIMING COMPENSATION for overbooking or flight delays

1.Prior to travel, obtain Air Passenger Rights Leaflet available on http://www.europa.eu.int/comm/transport/air/rights/index-en.htm.

2.Request that the airline representative give you written details of your rights explaining how to obtain compensation. The regulations require that the airline give this information to all passengers.

3.Set out your claim in writing.

4.If your claim for compensation is rejected then contact the Air Transport Users Council in writing or by telephone at:

45-59 Kingsway, London, WC2B 6TE Telephone No. 0207 240 6061

5.The Air Transport Users Council will be able to assist you on your behalf in order to try to negotiate an agreement between yourself and the airline. If there is no agreement reached and the airline refuses to pay you compensation then the matter will be placed in the hands of the Civil Aviation Authority who have the power to prosecute an airline. It can impose a penalty of £5,000 per case for failure to comply with the legislation.

6.The airline also has to reimburse you your air fare within 7-days if you have chosen not to fly because of the cancellation or the delay. You can have vouchers rather than money but only if you agree to this.

These new rules cover all charter flights, scheduled flights and low cost budget airlines. The criteria for claiming compensation is that the flight must be departing from an EU airport or flying into the EU on an EU airline.

Passengers who are delayed or have their flight cancelled are entitled to complimentary refreshments. On a short-haul flight if the delay is more than 2 hours, on a mid-range flight 3 hours or more and on a long-haul flight 4 hours or more. If the delay is excessive then passengers are also entitled to overnight accommodation, including a transfer to the hotel free of charge, or the airline must find alternative transport for the passengers to reach their final destination.

In the case of a flight being overbooked the airline have to ask for volunteers to give up their seat first. Any passenger who agrees to this can opt for cash benefits as well as the option of either a refund of their ticket with a free flight back to their point of departure or a later flight to their destination but they are not entitled to the additional compensation as specified above. However if a passenger is "bumped" against their will they are entitled to the compensation as specified above.

It is highly likely that in the case of delay airlines will try and avoid liability as there is within the regulations a get-out clause which allows the airline to avoid compensating passengers where the reason for the delay or cancellation is outside of the airline's control. For example adverse weather conditions, industrial action by airline staff or simply Air Traffic Control delays or overloads are all examples where compensation would not apply.

Airlines also will not have to compensate the passengers if they give 14-days notice or more regarding a cancellation or they provide a re-routed flight. So whilst these regulations give passengers enhanced rights that they previously did not have it is not compensation for every circumstance. Passengers should therefore collect all the relevant information together before considering whether it is appropriate to make a claim.

Jeez..... We've booked first choice premium for May and I hope they honour it, my brother is 6ft 3 with rheumatoid arthritis in his knees and even 4 hours is a long time for sitting in smaller seats, he'll be fairly peeved if they change us, just hoping they don't cos im a nervous enough traveller as it is

You SHOULD be ok for May the new service starts officially then so all the new aircraft will be ready.

Having contacted FC, one of the new planes WON'T be ready at the start of May.

However they say that all those who will be affected have been lettered in January and offered free ammendment / free cancellation.

So if you have NOT heard off them by now, you should be okay and receive Star Class

I think with that they are taking precations, the first aircraft took such a long time to get ready they need to leave themeselves a buffer. By the way the first new aircraft is currently due in Gatwick dinner time tommorow, we will have to wait and see though, they are still wating for paperwork.

So they should! Let's wait and see.

(lol top jet, I never would make a safety inspector, or anyone safety concious for that matter.)

The new aircraft is due in gatwick at midnight confirmed.

Hi Guys - im new to this site, but can add to this horror story!

My wife and i travelled to Cancun on Feb 14th with FCA, and discovered on take off that one of the toilets was out of order. We had payed 30 pound each for extra legroom as im 6ft 3in tall, but as we were sat at a bulkhead next to the out of service loo, then our legroom was used as a walkway - very annoying
2 hours from Cancun, all but one of the loos were broke and all refreshments were stopped, as we were told that if the remaining toliet broke, then we'd be diverted to Florida! Luckily this didnt happen, but there were many crossed legs for the last 2 hours!!!

Upon arriving at our Secrets Excellence resort (heaven on earth - in case you wondered!), we met another uk couple who had the same experience the previous week - this time they were diverted to florida, at a cost of 40k sterling

I am currently sat in the lounge, still at our hotel typing this - even though our flight is due to take off shortly. It seems that our flight has yet to leave Manchester, due to technical problems, and we have at least a 24hr delay - is this all due to the toilets again, i wonder? Its too much of a coincidence for it not to be in my opinion.
We have been unable to contact any travel rep - i had to call the actual store in the uk where i booked to get any information!!!! It seems that we MAY know more tomorrow (tues) at 9am (3pm uk time)

At least we have another day in paradise, but that doesnt help our situation with our jobs, and family at home etc (kids with relatives!). I wonder if we will be entitled to this new compensation?

Apologies for the monologue, but i wanted to share this with you - another pina colada por favour!!!

Ian

If it is any help your flight is currently showing an arrival at Manchester of 2300L 02Mar. If you want to keep uptodate try

http://www.manchesterairport.co.uk

rgds Ian

Thanks for that

Have just had a meeting with the rep - it seems that the we will now arrive in MAN approx 2am on Thursday!

Not sure how true this is, but the story of why our flight is so badly delayed is interesting.
Apparently, the new plane (or refurbished one) arrived in Gatwick with reported faults. The tech people checked this over, and gave it the ok. This plane left for MAN, to bring people out here (Cancun), but upon landing, the hydraulics failed on the landing gear, and one of the engines exploded!!!!!! Its now scrap!

What a saga! Glad that plane didnt make it out here afterall!

Thought I would update you on what happened on 22nd Feb, I posted that we had paid for premium then had been told by First Choice that they had overbooked (due to new plane not ready).

We got to Gatwick early and were told that the "new" plane would be taking us after all, we were given row 6.
We boarded the aircraft, then the captain said he was not happy, so we were all offloaded and were given rooms at Gatwick Hilton, told to return in the morning!

Next day we again got on the new plane (very nice) began to taxi .. stopped and all offloaded again !

We eventually left at 2pm on an old type 767 (which I think should have gone to Goa) we got row 6, which was premium but there were many who did not get premium who had booked it. They were all given 2 seats each, and got premium service.

On the return we did get the new aircraft, and very nice it is too.

First Choice have refunded all of our premium money (even though we got the seats) and also 2 days cost of our holiday even though we only lost one day.

I have received a cheque from them already, so no complaints from me now.

Hey, that's great news. I'm glad you've been given the service you deserve. Hope you had a great holiday.

passengers who are bumped? what exactly does this mean- i read it in the new law report in this web site and was wondering what this meant?

with first choice i would say nothing at all is guareenteed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!