Two tier pricing does indeed exist in Thaliand, and Vietnam and Malaysia and so on, they make no bones about it.

Go the the Grand Palace in Bangkok, you will pay one price and Thais a much cheaper one

I'm not saying its right but its not just Goa where it happens

we don't go to the places you mention. it is only goa that concerns us. just because they have dual pricing in other countries,doesn't make it right!!!!
BOB

guess that your going to have to live with it though

I didn't say it was right just that this is not localised to Goa

del949 wrote,

I chickened out on the brazilian

, Look at the subject heading

Best to be up front about this - I've never been to Goa! I have taken to browsing this forum because a friend keeps telling me 'You'll love it!' and I have indeed considered going at various times. But to be honest I'm not so sure that I will ever go and one of the reasons why I'm not sure is all this talk of being ripped off - not that I fear being ripped off - I can haggle with the best of them! It's more a case of feeling uncomfortable with thought that I'll encounter the sort of atmosphere I experienced in The Gambia where I was told off by another visitor at the hotel I was staying at for always telling the waiter to keep the 2 Dalassi change from the 20 Dalassi note I gave him to pay for my 2 litre bottle of chilled imported mineral water that cost less than it did in the supermarket at home. 'They'll expect us all to do that if you carry on' was what I was told! Given that at the time there were 25 Dalassi to the pound, I was very generously tipping him 8p for saving me the trek through the searing heat to collect one from the bar myself.

Whether we feel rich or not, compared to people living in the developing world, if we can afford to holiday in such places, then we are very rich compared to the locals. And whether we are aware of it or not, there's undoubtedly a two tier pricing system in operation the world over in relation to tourists and locals. I live right beside a Championship Open Course and as with some other such course in Scotland it's owned by the local authority and residents pay only a third of the price to play on it that visitors do on the grounds that our council tax helps maintain it. Racist? I don't think so and nor do the hordes of Americans who will seemingly pay any price to say they've played the course that defeated Tiger Woods!

And just a word of warning to anybody who objects to the sort of two tier pricing system you're discussing here - best to avoid Cuba at all costs as an alternative to Goa. There is most definitely a two tier pricing system there that is actually a twin track economy and one which is enforced by the Cuban Government. As a tourist you will always have to pay for everything in Convertible Pesos (CUCs) which are roughly worth 25 times the local pesos that the local population uses. And you will always pay twice as much as any local to get into any of the main music venues where the only acceptable currency is the CUC anyway. Go to Cuba and it is the Government that benefits from this two tier pricing system, not even the local population. It doesn't stop me loving it - I'm already planning my next trip for March - but it's not for those who fear being ripped off by being charged more than the locals. It's a tourist tax pure and simple and strikes me as being fair enough really. The cost of my annual trip including my spending money (which I don't consider excessive for what I get for my money and is based on staying with a local family rather than in a hotel) is approximately twice the annual salary of a fully qualified doctor. Makes me richer than all the dreams of Croesus compared to your average Cuban.

SM

The people involved at ALL levels in the tourist industry, are relative to the general population, very well off indeed, it is the general ripping off by those people, that people in this forum are, in many cases, complaining of. All over the world dual pricing does indeed exist, but does that mean it's ok? Many people scrimp and save for their holiday in Goa, and if they choose to take exception to being taken for a ride, that's their perogative. Not all of us are in the financial bracket that we can wave aside a few rps. here and there without a thought. As for the price of golf in Scotland, or conditions in Cuba, I will leave any comment of them, to a forum other than the Goan one. Alan

SMa - You really should try Goa! I've been ripped off all around the globe but at least the Goans do it nicely and in a completely non-confrontational way!!

You can't say that about southern Europe, America and Africa!

I think on the tipping front you do have to be careful because as already pointed out, what might not be a lot to us can be a days wages to a manual worker.If an airport porter can make a £1 for carrying a bag 20 yards then what chance anyone wants to train to be a qualified professional like a nurse for example. I remember having a meal in a restaurant in upstate Kerala which was used mostly by locals. We had joined our tour driver on his table after he had finished eating. We ordered the most expensive item on the menu which was a banquet and the bill came to 120 rupees. I went to leave a 30 rupee tip but the driver insisted I reduce it to 10 rupees. I could see his point. If they could make tips like that I guess they would prefer to serve tourists to locals and the latter might eventually be priced out.
As for being ripped off, well as others have said you have the choice to say "no". Yes some people want to get rich quick and who can blame them.They want the same standard of living that we have in the UK. Eventually India will probably be as expensive as Europe as they demand the same luxury goods we have had for years but it will be a gradual evolution , in the meantime it's no wonder lots of Brits choose to spend the winter in Goa. You can actually live like a lord on the state pension which is more than you can here.

one point that dave made here, is "you can say no" i fully agree with this!!!! and i previous posts on this forum i have said this.
i'm a bus driver in plymouth, we get lots of holidaymakers and foreign visitors to our city. when they get on my bus, they are charged exactly the same as a local person!!! i perform a public service, i niether get, nor expect TIPS!!!!!
as far as i'm aware, from one holiday resort (plymouth) no 2 tier pricing, to another(Goa) there is. i still say its wrong!!!!!
BOB

I have to say Bob, it doesn't make sense that a bus driver doesn't get tipped when a taxi driver does.IMO everyone should be paid a proper and decent wage in the first place and the cost reflected in the price the customer pays , best service should be given given as part of the job, the reward for giving it should be keeping the job and not a tip !

I have to agree with the post about over-tipping, just because to us it is not much money, it is to Indians. About ten years ago this same issue was explained to us by some Goan's we were friendly with. Because over-tipping ruins the local economy, prices go up - not just for tourists - because it is accepted that local shack/bar owners are making a lot of money, particularly from tips.
As said previously, you can still buy meals, beers, taxi's etc for 20-30 rupees outside of resorts, yet we, like idiots, give pound coins to the airport workers who harrass you and pounce on your bag at the airport- approx 80 rupees!! They must be the highest paid workers in India.
Police from all over India pay bribe money to get posted to Goa, because they know that they can extort money from tourists (riding scooters), and from sellers and shack owners on the beaches. It is to pay these leeches that prices have to go up. Also there is a 'Goan Mafia' extorting money from sellers etc who come from Karnatica and Kashmir to make a living during the tourist season. They all beat up sellers-both women and children- who cannot pay their increasing demands (and steal their property).
I am afraid Goa is a paradise lost, and we have only ourselves to blame.

:offtop.... May I ask one of the people who live in Goa to please keep us right what should we give as a tip to the place you had your meal ...your room boy ....the shack boys ....I would not give the boys at the airport a bean not after someone on the forum told me a days pay in Goa is a pound ..I would rather give my pound to a wee lady in the street digging roads with a baby strapped
to her back ....AND I DO ..thanks colleen

Re tips : it's the same the world over, between 0-15% for me, depending on the level of service received

SMa - You really should try Goa! I've been ripped off all around the globe but at least the Goans do it nicely and in a completely non-confrontational way!!

I'm sure they do, Roma, and it's not the Goans that put me off! It's the thought of the possible attitudes of some of the other visitors that is giving me pause for thought :-) Yes, the bumsters can be irritating in The Gambia but I know how to be assertive and don't have a problem with that (I honed my skills in Tunisia!) but I was shocked to be told off by a fellow guest for tipping a waiter 10% for providing an excellent service - it's what I do at home and couldn't see why in Gambia this meant I was responsible for making all the waiters too greedy! Especially since I saw no point in building up a great collection of small change. He needed that 10% a darn sight more than most of the people I routinely tip 10% to at home. And don't get me going on the sex tourists - that would take us seriously !!!!

SM

it doesn't make sense that a bus driver doesn't get tipped when a taxi driver does.

It does to me, because I usually get extra help from a taxi driver that I rarely get from a bus driver. Where I live we used to have conductors on the buses who helped passengers on and off if they needed it - but no more - which means that all us passengers have to lug on and off our own luggage, buggies, great bags of shopping etc while the driver just sits there and if we're particularly unlucky, sits there scowling at us for the time it takes! Not you I'm sure Bobthebus Whereas, the taxi drivers from the firm I regularly use always jump out of their cabs, take the baggage off me, stow it in the boot etc and when they drop me off at home take it into the hall for me. They don't have to do this but I appreciate that they do and think it reasonable to tip them for doing so - and no I don't tip them if they've sat there and watched me struggle. But I think the word must be getting round and it's a long time since that's happened to me

SM

SMa wrote:

it doesn't make sense that a bus driver doesn't get tipped when a taxi driver does.

It does to me, because I usually get extra help from a taxi driver that I rarely get from a bus driver. Where I live we used to have conductors on the buses who helped passengers on and off if they needed it - but no more - which means that all us passengers have to lug on and off our own luggage, buggies, great bags of shopping etc while the driver just sits there and if we're particularly unlucky, sits there scowling at us for the time it takes! Not you I'm sure Bobthebus Whereas, the taxi drivers from the firm I regularly use always jump out of their cabs, take the baggage off me, stow it in the boot etc and when they drop me off at home take it into the hall for me. They don't have to do this but I appreciate that they do and think it reasonable to tip them for doing so - and no I don't tip them if they've sat there and watched me struggle. But I think the word must be getting round and it's a long time since that's happened to me

SM

Lucky you. They don't even come to the door around here to tell you they have arrived and are likely to clear off rather than get out of their cabs.
Most trips we take don't involve luggage.
I would say that the coach driver that picks you up from the airport, stacks all the bags and unloads them by himself is an equally deserving case as the taxi driver that picks you up.

Well we had a coach driver one year who was refusing to unlock the boot to take the suitcases out until he was tipped! That made me determined that he should not receive a tip. Straight after that there were 2 porters arguing the toss over who should take our suitcases. OH and I simple wheeled our cases away leaving them screaming at each other!

I am quite happy to tip for good service, and yes we generally work on the 10-15% rule. But if it is expected or not deserved then a tip is not forthcoming.

And no I will not be giving any tips to the porters at the Airport, they would be lucky to be able to prise my case off of me in any case