Sma, It's the same in Spain, but some tourists think "oh well, it's only Spain and I'm on holiday, I've paid for it, so I'll do what I want"
Spain is still a catholic country with strong family bonds, and it is disrespectful to go into a church in Spain half dressed and women should have something over their shoulders to cover the tops of their arms.

40 years ago, you'd have been thrown into a Spanish prison for walking about half naked and being disrespectful to the catholic religion - Franco would have seen to it.

Sanji x

Yes, in Franco's day women could not go out on the streets with their shoulders uncovered. I once watched a German tourist being lifted right off the beach by the Policia for changing on the beach and omitting to cover up his dangly bits.

Sanji and Pollensa, I'm sure you are right - it's just that I have never visited the mainland Spanish Coastal resorts or the Balearics so couldn't comment on that directly. In mainland Spain, I have only ever visited and stayed in inland towns and cites, especially Seville and Granada, where it is less likely to happen but only because most people, even tourists, tend not to work around the streets in swimwear in those situations! Though I have seen the occasional fairly skimpy outfits on visitors in the salsa bars at night but then that is a very different time and place. And on La Gomera in the Canaries it rarely arises either simply because the churches and cathedrals don't attract many tourists in the first place.

SM

The problem tends to arise when you have a working town or city that has a beach, and the beach attire spills over from the playa area into the 'workings' of the city.
Places inland such as Sevilla or Granada won't have the problem of near nudity adorning their streets, however, they do have the problem of tourists not dressing appropriately when visiting religious buildings and museums etc.

Sanji x

.Places inland such as Sevilla or Granada won't have the problem of near nudity adorning their streets, however, they do have the problem of tourists not dressing appropriately when visiting religious buildings and museums etc.

Though when I think about it, the probable reason for why I haven't been as aware of it in places like Seville and Granada is probably because of the times of year I've been there. The second half of October was warmer than here but still not beachwear weather and the one year I was in Seville in April it was the worst weather in living memory for the Feria! I learnt a whole load of new vocab that year - words like huracanados, inundaciones, cancelada, impermeable and paraguas

SM

i have never understood why people think it is ok to go into a bar or restaurant in a resort in swimwear and i will personally not use places that allow this

Surely it is acceptable to use the bars etc along the promenades in swimwear, especially if sitting outside having a drink or snack.

I have mainly visited Turkey,Tunisia and Egypt these past few years and when I go out of the hotel I wear T shirts,not vest tops and skirts or 3/4 trousers.
I may be old fashioned but I have never had anything other than respect off the locals.
My pet hate is men in vests at dinner!Why do they think this is OK.
I went to a hotel in Egypt in December that is highly rated and some of the guests looked like the cast of Shameless in the restaurant at dinner.
How nice it was to see everyone dressed appropriately for dinner in Benidorm.
I think I may look at the resorts in Majorca near to Palma for my next holiday.

Why do they think this is OK

.

Why do you think it's not OK?
Surely it's a matter of personal choice and the kind of place you are eating.
If you don't want to eat in places that allow this kind of apparel you are free to eat elsewhere.

I am talking about restaurants in 4 and 5 star hotels.!
Men are not allowed in Working Mens clubs in vests so I was surprised they were allowed in a restaurant of a 5 star hotel.

the hotel management must think that it's OK if they allow it.
A lot also depends on if you are talking about vests as in underwear type, or vests in the printed cotton casual wear type.
Would you have the same objection to a woman wearing a coloured vest top?

Back on topic, reports I've read state that the town hall at Palma are still finalising details of the amount of the fines.

There's to be no open air drinking in the city centre also.

del949 wrote:

A lot also depends on if you are talking about vests as in underwear type, or vests in the printed cotton casual wear type.

I think that the key is the word 'casual'. A man wearing a vest style top is in casual dress - there's really no such thing as a 'dressy' or formal vest top for men and on the whole they are unlikely to wear them with smart tailored trousers. Whereas, for women a vest top can take the form of anything from a tankini top with spaghetti straps to a very dressy formal beaded top. I can't speak for Jaytrip but, yes, in the restaurant of a 4/5* hotel restaurant of an evening I would expect a smarter dress code than any sort of vest style top implies for men.

For some people, wearing smarter clothes for the evening is all part of the holiday experience - dressing for dinner (even if not in the old fashioned sense) is a key part of the rhythm of the day for many people on holiday and I can understand why some people would think that it takes something away from the experience for them if they feel that others appear not to be making the same sort of effort. It can effect the ambience and that is a key factor for many and can affect their enjoyment. 'Going down for dinner' is more than just sitting at a table and eating some food for lots of people.

Cuban society is very informal in nearly all aspects of life but it is noticeable that of an evening, even when all we have planned is a drink in a bar followed by going dancing, despite the heat, the Cuban men will usually wear a short sleeved shirt and for anything other than the most casual of evenings out, one with a collar to it. So not necessarily a tailored collar but at the very least a polo shirt rather than a t-short with a round neck for example. The short sleeve and the collar (even if a soft one) is what distinguishes suitable dress for an evening out from daywear. But it is really noticeable that the British men more often than not never quite master this dress code of how to look smart in extreme heat and humidity.

As a good friend remarked to me one evening - as he looked around the table, all the women and the Cuban men looked as if they have made the effort and looked really good. And that despite having showered and changed, put on freshly laundered clothes, he and most of the other British men looked as if they hadn't made an effort. And I noticed that the next time we were both in Cuba at the same time, he had packed a couple of pairs of smart chinos and couple of polo collared shirts. He now looked as if he had made the effort, he looked more at ease of an evening and, yes, he had finally cracked the problem that some British men struggle with - finding that halfway house between the formality of a jacket, collar and tie and the extreme informality of looking as if they are heading for the gym or are off to play a knockabout game of football. If we are both there at the same time in September I'll be gently leading him to the Quitin shop and will get him trying on the Guayabera shirts and he will then have suitable clothes for all possible eventualities in Cuba

SM

I thought it was legal to go naked in Spain

Well Richard Osman on 'Pointless' yesterday certainly said that it wasn't illegal to go naked in Spain in that there was no law saying you couldn't so you presumably could. So I assume he meant that there wasn't the equivalent of our catch-all public decency laws?

But I guess that this could also be about the difference between national laws that apply throughout the country and the equivalent of our local by-laws? For example, I don't think that there is a blanket ban on drinking alcohol outdoors throughout Scotland but it is certainly against local by-laws in my seaside town and the neighbouring town and city, as there is in most of the little seaside villages and towns in this part of Scotland. That said, I've never known anybody pulled up by the police for enjoying a glass of wine or a can of beer with a picnic on the prom or beside the beach and so it is probably aimed at what is perceived as 'problem' drinkers.

SM

For some people, wearing smarter clothes for the evening is all part of the holiday experience - dressing for dinner (even if not in the old fashioned sense) is a key part of the rhythm of the day for many people on holiday and I can understand why some people would think that it takes something away from the experience for them if they feel that others appear not to be making the same sort of effort. It can effect the ambience and that is a key factor for many and can affect their enjoyment. 'Going down for dinner' is more than just sitting at a table and eating some food for lots of people

.

I fully understand that argument and to be honest usually dress sensibly myself.
The point I was taking issue with was "why do they feel that it is OK".
Quite clearly they do feel it is OK and why shouldn't they.
The argument that they are taking something away from holiday experience has the flip side that if compelled to dress for dinner then possibly something would be taken away from their experience.
For all we know they may be compelled to wear a uniform or dress clothes most of the time and relish the freedom to be ultra casual.
Surely everyone is allowed dress freedom, or is it just reserved for some?

I was simply offering an explanation as to why Jaytrip might feel it wasn't OK, not arguing that people shouldn't have freedom of choice as to how to dress on their holiday

It's a tricky one, especially with the growth of AI holidays, where people could be limited in their choice of dining, because the great majority of guests aren't going to want to leave the hotel to eat of an evening, even assuming that there are places away from the hotel that they can do that.

SM

del949 wrote:

The point I was taking issue with was "why do they feel that it is OK".
Quite clearly they do feel it is OK and why shouldn't they.

Taken to its logical conclusion you have a state of anarchy... I can do what I like and if it offends then I don't care. I don't think you would enjoy the company of that type on holiday.

Quite clearly they do feel it is OK and why shouldn't they.

Why? two words spring to mind- etiquette and decorum.
My hubby wears a vest/tank top when walking on the promenade, he wants to get a tan as much as the next person, but he would never take it off and walk topless on the promenade, he wouldn't dream of going down to breakfast in one, and it wouldn't enter his head to attempt to go down for dinner in the hotel restaurant in one - and in any case, in the hotel we stay in, he wouldn't get through the restaurant doors before being told to go away and put something on with sleeves, either a short sleeved shirt, polo shirt or a t-shirt.

If he leaves the beach for whatever reason, even just to walk the few yards back to the hotel grounds, he will put his top on. And he himself ( from another bloke's point of view) has commented that doesn't like to see blokes sat opposite him bare chested, when he's eating.

On the hygiene level - It's enough to put anyone off their breakfast seeing the long straggly hairs dangling from under the armpits and caked up with white powder, that's dropping like dandruff from the deodorant they've used when blokes are reaching over the display cabinets to get their breakfast.
Dave spent his life working for the bank, everyday whatever the weather, it was a full suit, shirt and tie that he had to wear, so, my own personal view is, that it all depends on how you've been brought up.

Sanji

The vests were the kind that have armholes that expose the armpits,not sleeveless T shirts..
They were the underwear type and one bloke had the same one on all day and stunk of BO!
He was an older bloke and should have known better.
The younger ones wore chino shorts and polo shirts or T shirt at dinner.
I do not want to sit next to someone in a vest after we have made the effort to shower and put on decent clothes appropriate for a restaurant.
My husband wouldnt even dare to attempt to wear a vest at dinner.!
Ladies vest tops as SMa mentioned are not underwear types and are usually worn with a smart skirt or trousers.
When I asked the head waiter why the sign saying no beachwear at dinner was ignored he said they didnt want to upset their guests!
I will go back to the sister hotel nearby where they do adhere to the dress code.