Just wanted to add that even if your daughter had decided not to go and the 'friend' obtained a 'not fit to fly' certificate it wouldn't automatically follow that your daughter could have claimed for her lost holiday.

Yes, I understand this, but at the time I had no time to think about insurance; the way I saw it with 5 mins to spare was that this girl does not appear ill and my daughter will lose her holiday and all the money. We were obviously delayed leaving for the aiport and were only just in time to check in.

Can a 'not fit to fly' certificate be applied retrospectively? I am worried she could pursuade a doctor that she was ill regardless of the fact that she had an undisturbed night's sleep and did not seek urgent medical attention.

Can a 'not fit to fly' certificate be applied retrospectively? I am worried she could pursuade a doctor that she was ill regardless of the fact that she had an undisturbed night's sleep and did not seek urgent medical attention.

I think that would very much depend on the diagnosis of what was exactly wrong with her. If she had been rushed to hospital with appendicitis then yes but if she just claimed a dodgy tummy but sought no medical advise at the time, I would think not. Having said that, some doctors can be very accommodating.

If you can provide evidence, such as the Facebook comment, that she could be trying to pull a fast one she could find herself in trouble if she did go legal.

I still think the way forward is to ask the friend how much she is expecting to get back. If its only a couple of hundred it might be easier all round to pay up.

I think if there was only the 2 of them going then the insurance would have paid up if one of the party were ill. Surely they wouldn't expect someone to go on holiday on their own?

I think if there was only the 2 of them going then the insurance would have paid up if one of the party were ill. Surely they wouldn't expect someone to go on holiday on their own?

My daughter could have claimed of her insurance but it would be reliant on the friend providing evidence that she was unfit to travel. If I was the insurance company with the facts in hand I would not pay up for this claim, the only evidence she has is her say so that she felt unwell. The problem is if a doctor is willing to believe this hours later and issue a certificate.

I understand why you don't think she deserves any money back but essentially second daughter has had a free holiday so perhaps giving back 50% of the cost would smooth the waters

I consider myself to be a fair person and I was willing to pay a small amount to her, but her actions since have demonstrated her complete lack of morals. Also someone mentioned previously if I offer anything it may be construed as an admission that she is due her money back and may give her leverage to get it all.

Call me a cynical old crone but on re-reading this thread I've just realised that you seem to only have the friend's word for it that

a) She had insurance,

b) They have refused to pay out because someone else went in her place.

All sorts of scenarios are starting to play out in my mind:

Did she have insurance? Or didn't she bother and is now realising the implications of this and is trying to get something back from you because she has no insurance that she can claim against in the first place?

She had insurance but because she has not/cannot get a certificate confirming that she was too ill to fly is now trying to cut her losses by trying to get something back from your family?

She did have insurance and will get something back from them but is trying it on to see if she can get something out of your family in addition to this?

I fully accept that I might be doing the girl a disservice here but before paying her anything I think you need to see proof that she really has explored all other channels for trying to recover this money ie that she has contacted her insurer and that they have refused to pay her anything and the reasons why. If she didn't have any insurance to cover her for cancellation due to illness then I would personally be reluctant to pay her anything - she hasn't taken due care to try and protect any losses herself. On the other hand if she did have insurance and they have definitely refused to consider her claim because your other daughter accompanied her sister then I might consider making her an offer less the expenses you incurred in name changes etc.

Did she have insurance

Yes, she had, I saw the letter, as she was holding the tickets and it was all together in an envelope, but didn't take a close look and can't remember who it was with.

she has not/cannot get a certificate confirming that she was too ill to fly

This is my biggest worry I do not know if she got this, if she did manage to convince a doctor then she maybe could have claimed off the insurance, but they have said they won't because someone else took the place. This is why she thinks my daughter should pay. Would the insurance pay up if the money was irrecoverable?

Exactly the same thing crossed my mind SMa- I don't think I would take this girl's word for anything. As I said previously, the only way to know for sure that the Insurers won't pay out is if she has it in writing from them.

her friend thinks she may have glandular fever and says she has been unwell over the last few months

Why hadn't she done anything about it beforehand then - it all sounds very vague what she is saying - and who has said she may have glandular fever - a doctor? Glandular fever is contagious and generally people feel rather unwell if they have that - certainly not well enough to go to a festival!

I would be inclined to keep copies of the facebook comments and any emails/texts which may have been exchanged. Also she may well be texting your daughter about this - possibly spoiling her holiday yet further - but I would suggest your daughter simply tells her she will speak to her about matters upon her return and refrain from any further dialogue - since you don't know at this stage how matters will work out - least said soonest mended!

If it's any consolation, in the circumstances you found yourself in 5 minutes prior to leaving for the airport, I too would have done the same thing. It's not a cut and dried situation, but I certainly wouldn't dream of parting with a penny unless you have seen the Insurers letter, medical certificate etc and if you feel at some point the situation may be best resolved with some financial compensation, then do so in the form of a cheque.

In order for the insurance company to pay out for your daughters 'friend' they would need a cancellation invoice from the tour operator showing that she had cancelled her holiday. As the alteration was done as a name change she will be unable to get this invoice. On that assumption I can see why they are saying they cannot pay because someone else travelled instead of her.

I think you need to ask her to show you evidence that she actually a got a doctors certificate stating she was unfit to travel. If she can perhaps you might morally be obliged to contribute towards her loss. If she can't I would tell her where to go! If you do make some monetary recomponse to her don't forget to deduct any spending money etc. that you might have had to give to your other daughter.

That said I do not agree with the way she left your daughter in the lurch with no regards for anyone but herself. Going off her facebook 'in a relationship' staus it does look rather like she just changed her mind.

From the info we've got it seems to me like she has no idea about the consequences of paying for something and entering into a contract with a tour operator. She woke up in the morning - her alarm must've been set to get her up for the airport - felt a bit under the weather and decided she wasn't going. She probably thought that if she didn't go, the money would be refunded.

I too would be furious and it's very lucky that your other daughter could go - no doubt stressed at having to pack a suitcase last minute and with nothing organised! On the basis of the info given it seems highly unlikely that she went near a doctor.

I hope things get sorted. I'm sure your daughter won't be making any sort of plans with her in the future, if they are even friends after this.

Why is it that folks who come on here are clued up and clue their kids up when they get old enough to travel abroad on their own - yet so many 'other people's kids' don't seem to have any idea of the seriousness of this sort of behaviour? Had I been the friend my own parents would have given me one serious b**cking and would have told me in no uncertain terms that I had lost my money entirely through my own actions.

OP, have you spoken to the girls parents at all? Have they had any involvement?

So the insurance company won't pay for good reason, so I have had second thoughts since my earlier post. As the second daughter did get a free holiday (and is on holiday now). Someone has to pay for it. So either the person who didn't go looses the cost of the holiday, and therefore pays for your daughter to go free, or you in some way refund (part or full) the cost to them.

Passengers can't just change their minds (sounds like that's what happened) and decide not to travel on the departure day and then expect an insurance company to pay out. Maybe because she is young, that is what she thought she could do and didn't understand. She could still have gone to a doctor after missing the flight, who would have given her a medical note if she was unwell.

How you all came to this is terrible. I think you'd want to put an end to it on their return.

What, bump her off you mean?

Actually I had thought she was 17 when in fact she is 19 but still.......... I do agree I think she is just clueless. But if she is still living with folks and had it been me, I would stand by what I said - they would be furious with me.

But if she is still living with folks and had it been me, I would stand by what I said - they would be furious with me.

She is living at home, she did not telephone her mum until she had told me that she didn't want to go and I asked if she had spoken to her mum, she said no, so I told her that I thought she should ring and speak with her. After she had done this and I asked what her mum had said sand she just said that her mum had told her it was "up to her". The girl had stayed over at my house in preparation for an early start. If it had been my daughter and I had received that call I would have been round there straight away worried that my daughter was v poorly and unfit to travel. She would have been in the doctors immediately, in the event her mum did not collect her for another hour. Or i would have told her in no uncertain terms to stop being so stupid and get ready and get in the car! And if my daughter had decided not to go then she would have to take the consequences for her stupidity, I would have little symapthy for her.

I think the girl may have gone to the doctors as she says she may have glandular fever but I don't know when or if she got an unfit to travel certificate. She told me that she had been feeling unwell for a few months and that she was intending to go to the hospital for tests, if this is so she surely would have had to have declared it to the insurance company even if the insurance was already in force at the time, i think she may have an annual policy.

Yes, she should have informed her insurance company. I would have thought if she had been feeling unwell for months, knowing that she had a holiday coming up, she would have consulted a doctor earlier. Maybe she had and he had referred her for tests. If this was the case, I would have thought that she would have asked her gp if she was ok to go abroad. Which ever way, leaving it until the very last minute was irresponsible. I still think there was more to it than just feeling ill.

Do make sure that you keep the Facebook comments - can you do a screenshot of them and print out a copy? They would be invaluable in case of any legal action. Mind you, this girl sounds very immature and may just be trying it on. If she's going on about possible glandular fever and had been expecting to go for tests (you don't just decide to go to the hospital for tests, surely you have to be referred), had she declared this on her insurance as if she hadn't, then I would think that the insurance would be invalid anyway. Good luck with everything - hope you daughters enjoy their holiday. And if it was me, I wouldn't pay her a penny. Again though, do take screenshots of the Facebook page where she's asking for festival tickets for that weekend - it's bloody good evidence against her.

To me, seeing as she changed her status on Facebook to in a relationship, it seems as though she's met a fella and didn't want to go away and leave him - oh, the folly of youth (and how glad I am to have be older and have more wisdom LOL!!).

I may be completely off in my reasoning (nothing new!) but it sounds very fishy to me. If you have planned to go on holiday you generally do everything you can to get away even if you feel a bit 'liverish' on the day of travel ..................

That sort of notice of not going is frankly offensive, and this young lady has to learn the meaning of contracts and commitment.

I am glad that your younger daughter was able to fill her place, and that the TO was able to change the name on the ticket, but that does not excuse the friend and her payment. And her subsequent action of trying to find a concert ticket for the following weekend does not impress me.

why should you pay the said friend anything....?

she changed her mind, for whatever reason and chose not to go, she wasnt openly ill......

glandular fever makes you quite poorly and can be confirmed with a simple blood test

as she cancelled so late in the day, ie, day of travel, she was entitled to nothing back from the holiday company..

sorry, but i wouldnt give her a penny, she proved that her friendship wasnt her priority.

let her take the legal route , and then pay if you have too.

as usual I like to shed a different light on things.....

all focus seems on your and your daughters obligation or lack of it to compensate her fiend....

there is the otherside of the coin...

when the holiday was first booked both girls made a contract even if only verbally to accompany each other on that particular holiday....it was benificial to both parties in many ways for the same reasons...both wished to go on holiday....both would have a companion for pleasure and support ..both felt safer as there can be dangers for females who travel alone....neither would pay a single suppliment

when both girls paid their deposits they acknowledge the contract existed....when they paid final balance they reinforced the contract already existing between them ....

your daughters friend did not fulfil her part of the contract.....in theory your daughter could counter sue her friend for breach of contract....which caused her distress and anxciety....she could claim the cost of taking her sister as a replacement companion ....plus any extra cost incurred....also compensation for the loss of enjoyment of her holidays due to friends actions imeddiately prior and whilst away on said holiday...

your daughter could sue her friend as her sister was basically a hired companion ....she hired out of nescessity as a direct concequence of her friends actions ....not just breach of contract but how and when it was breached ....

futher to cost of companions holiday would be companions expenses whilst accompanying your daughter on outings meals ect which were fundamental to the enjoyment of her holiday....which she could have expected if friend had not breached her contract to accompany her.

Thanks for all of the advice and encouraging comments.

Do make sure that you keep the Facebook comments - can you do a screenshot of them and print out a copy

I did do this,fortunately, as now she has removed the comment - funny that!

I am just going to have to wait and see what happens next, probably after next Wednesday when the girls get back.

your daughter could sue her friend as her sister was basically a hired companion

This holiday has resulted in extra expense, they are in an all inclusive resort, but I have had to put money in the older daughter's bank so she can cover expenses for her sister, I've spent £25 topping up thier mobiles so that they can keep in touch, they have has to buy extra toiletries as my younger daughter had no time to pack.

The worst case scenario is if she manages to produce an unfit to fly certificate and her insurance comapny confirm that they would have settled the case. I am not sure if the insurance company would consider the claim as she is unable to recover the money.

I would ride it out and would not part with a single penny.

I would assume that even the good old hand of the law would clearly see that five minutes notice to salvage the much anticipated holiday means that you had no time to think about the legal rights or wrongs. It was her holiday and she paid for it yes but everyone needs a certain period of notice to make a stand in court.

If the friend had been taken away in an emergency situation ie an ambulance it would be completely different but the fact is she just did not want to go, if she did she would have contacted the doctor long before she did.

As other posters have said you only have the word of this girl about what has happened and what is going on anyway and it does not sound as though her word counts for anything at all.

It sounds like the friendship is a waste of time anyway and on that note you certainly don't owe her any favours as she sounds completely selfish.